Joe Gibbs Leaving Is Good for The Warpath

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

I'm on the same page, SS. This is an unretarded thread.

A big faction of Skins fans supported Gibbs on blind faith, and almost shied away from honest analysis because they just couldn't bring themselves to say anything critical about the guy. Maybe that's just a symptom of refusing to think about anything but the positive, and in that case, those people will see no change in behavior. Or maybe now we're opening ourselves up to an opportunity to give a more honest, no-sh*t assessment when we examine the team and its coach.

There's also a big faction who think it's "uncool" to associate themselves with the past and want to be hip by presenting a "What have you done for me lately" attitude.

Look, bottom line is all sides are guilty of letting emotion get in the way of Gibbs. The "Gibbs is my generation" folks and the "Gibbs never did anything for me" people.

Either way, we're all right to have passion and emotion still we'll all benefit from a tabula rasa

[MTK]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

There's also a big faction who think it's "uncool" to associate themselves with the past and want to be hip by presenting a "What have you done for me lately" attitude.

Look, bottom line is all sides are guilty of letting emotion get in the way of Gibbs. The "Gibbs is my generation" folks and the "Gibbs never did anything for me" people.

Either way, we're all right to have passion and emotion still we'll all benefit from a tabula rasa

I've often thought a similar thing... that some want to go against the grain just for the sake of going against the grain.

[cpayne5]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

I've often thought a similar thing... that some want to go against the grain just for the sake of going against the grain.

It's also easy to be a pessimistic fan because in the end you're going to be happy about something. Think about it; if you proclaim doom and gloom to be on its way and you're right, then you get the credit (albeit, many times its your own hand patting your own back). If you're not right, you still get to partake in the celebration of a successful season. (I guess, in order to be happy, you actually have to be a fan, though).

[MTK]

Originally Posted by cpayne5

It's also easy to be a pessimistic fan because in the end you're going to be happy about something. Think about it; if you proclaim doom and gloom to be on its way and you're right, then you get the credit (albeit, many times its your own hand patting your own back). If you're not right, you still get to partake in the celebration of a successful season. (I guess, in order to be happy, you actually have to be a fan, though).

Yep, sounds like having your cake and eating it too.

[mheisig]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

I've often thought a similar thing... that some want to go against the grain just for the sake of going against the grain.

Some people get off on being contrarian.

Especially computer programmers. What the hell is it with them? Being different for the sake of being different is asinine. Be different for a rational reason, not just because.

[skinsguy]

Originally Posted by mheisig

Some people get off on being contrarian.

Especially computer programmers. What the hell is it with them? Being different for the sake of being different is asinine. Be different for a rational reason, not just because.

Whhhhaaatttt? :confused:

[BleedBurgundy]

I personally think there's a whole lot of immaturity on the site. Too many people hold on to grudges based on nothing more than having a difference of opinion. Still others insist on bringing everyone else down to their level with ridiculous threads of "i told you so" and "amnesty..." which do nothing so much as breed dissension.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by BleedBurgundy

I personally think there's a whole lot of immaturity on the site. Too many people hold on to grudges based on nothing more than having a difference of opinion. Still others insist on bringing everyone else down to their level with ridiculous threads of "i told you so" and "amnesty..." which do nothing so much as breed dissension.

Agreed. And what's with all the "I'm going to get flamed for this but..." posts lately?

Why even say that?

[BleedBurgundy]

I think people issue the b.s. disclosure because, in their mind, it gives them the right to post whatever nonsense that has come to mind without being responsible for the content or effects of their post. It's an amateur form of libel where someone says something ridiculous and defamatory without taking credit for their statement, i.e. "I don't know if it's true or not, and you guys will probably blast me for this, but I heard that Gibbs retired because he's senile."

[BDBohnzie]

Originally Posted by BleedBurgundy

I think people issue the b.s. disclosure because, in their mind, it gives them the right to post whatever nonsense that has come to mind without being responsible for the content or effects of their post. It's an amateur form of libel where someone says something ridiculous and defamatory without taking credit for their statement, i.e. "I don't know if it's true or not, and you guys will probably blast me for this, but I heard that Gibbs retired because he's senile."

Mr. Dennit: Ricky, your little obscene gesture is going to cost you 100 points. Do you know how much that costs us in sponsorship dollars?
Ricky: With all due respect, Mr. Dennit, I had no idea you'd gotten experimental surgery to have your balls removed.
Mr. Dennit: What did you just say to me?
Ricky: What? I said it with all due respect!
Mr. Dennit: Just because you say that doesn't mean you get to say whatever you want to me!
Ricky: Yes, it does!
Mr. Dennit: No, it doesn't!
Ricky: It's in the Geneva Conventions, look it up!

Gibbs leaving will curb the emotion for now. However, once the season kicks into gear, I don't it changing much. You can change the players and coaches, but you can't change the fans...

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Because he's joining us as a moderator! j/k

Seriously though, in a strange way I feel that Gibbs' resignation is a positive step for discussions on this board. The bulk of my time here has been during Gibbs II.

And one thing that I think really affected our discussions and evaluation of Joe Gibbs is that we all had different perspectives and memories of him. Someone like Mooby isn't old enough to remember seeing live Darryl Grant highstepping into the end zone after intercepting a batted Dexter Manley pass in an NFC Championship game in front of a rocking RFK, the way Skinsguy can. Skinsguy probably doesn't remember Gibbs making his presence felt in the NFL for the first time in the early 1970s crafting a high powered St. Louis Cardinals offense, the way Backrow does.

I don't know, I guess I'm just rambling here.

But my point is, now with a new head coach we should all have a clean slate with which to evaluate him. Even if it's someone like Williams or Cowher who has experience being an NFL head coach, none of us have any emotional attachment to them as such.

That make sense?

It does make sense, however, I feel the bigger reason is that everyone felt like the Skins would return to glory after going through that Spurrier disaster. We all got excited that our saviour was back. Now we're all upset that he's gone.

[backrow]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Because he's joining us as a moderator! j/k

Seriously though, in a strange way I feel that Gibbs' resignation is a positive step for discussions on this board. The bulk of my time here has been during Gibbs II.

And one thing that I think really affected our discussions and evaluation of Joe Gibbs is that we all had different perspectives and memories of him. Someone like Mooby isn't old enough to remember seeing live Darryl Grant highstepping into the end zone after intercepting a batted Dexter Manley pass in an NFC Championship game in front of a rocking RFK, the way Skinsguy can. Skinsguy probably doesn't remember Gibbs making his presence felt in the NFL for the first time in the early 1970s crafting a high powered St. Louis Cardinals offense, the way Backrow does.

I don't know, I guess I'm just rambling here.

But my point is, now with a new head coach we should all have a clean slate with which to evaluate him. Even if it's someone like Williams or Cowher who has experience being an NFL head coach, none of us have any emotional attachment to them as such.

That make sense?

Hey, Honey, I've made the B I G T I M E!

I never thought that I would be included in with such elite company. But, we after all are a Band of Brothers!

I did see all of HOF Gibbs 1.0, and the twelve plus years before his arrival.

I know that I'm O L D! But, hey, age is what keeps me going!

[Daseal]

As someone who was around from about the beginning of the Spurrier era to present, I don't think we'll see a lot of optimist vs pessimist arguments continue. While there will be some people who hold out faith regardless, there won't be such a strong feeling for the coach. This Gibbs cycle went hardcore to both sides of the spectrum. The Gibbs can do no wrong faction and the Gibbs can do no right faction. This just isn't good for discussion -- and I think the board will improve.

Cpayne: Say what you will, I admitted that I was wrong about the skins missing the playoffs, and I gave the team and Joe Gibbs lots of credit for the end of year run, but when you're needing other teams to lose, it's far from an ideal situation. If you win the Super Bowl, you've done everything you need to. However, that doesn't mean you did everything right, regardless of who you are you can always improve.

There's also a big faction who think it's "uncool" to associate themselves with the past and want to be hip by presenting a "What have you done for me lately" attitude.

I don't agree with this at all. It's often said the NFL is a what have you done for me lately league. That's how it works. I can't think of a single person who's basing the Gibbs of the 80s/90s. Everyone gives him the credit he's due. When he came back to the NFL I was very excited. I love Spurrier, I still think he could have won -- but it would require big changes, mainly to bringing some NFL experience into DC with his staff and to work on getting better players, something Gibbs did very well. However, when Gibbs did come in, I thought he would be an excellent coach. I knew he was a great leader, and had heard stories about his coaching prowess. I guess I slowly and slowly got upset with the sidelines thing. It's not because I want to "be cool". I do think that everything has changed so much from the 80s/90s to present. For instance, I think Gibbs' superbowl teams would struggle with a mediocre team today -- not because of Gibbs, players or coaching, just the advancements in technology, the bigger/stronger/faster athletes of today, etc. To me it wasn't a cool or uncool thing. It was a mix of seeing consistent progression and improvement that was lacking.

What I do when I look for the Redskins, is in good or bad see where we can improve. I often have less to say after a well played loss than a poorly played win. While the win is the most important thing, I don't understand why we can't look at a team and say this is where and why we have to improve. Win or loss.

This has gotten a bit more long winded than I meant, sorry. I'm just trying to explain myself a bit clearer. I feel often times I don't convey the message I mean to through my posts. Things I say are misconstrued or taken out of context. This is no ones fault but my own for not making things more concise. I don't 'hate' the team, I don't 'hate' Joe Gibbs. I just try to look at things from a balanced perspective -- or at least what I think is a balanced perspective.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Daseal

As someone who was around from about the beginning of the Spurrier era to present, I don't think we'll see a lot of optimist vs pessimist arguments continue. While there will be some people who hold out faith regardless, there won't be such a strong feeling for the coach. This Gibbs cycle went hardcore to both sides of the spectrum. The Gibbs can do no wrong faction and the Gibbs can do no right faction. This just isn't good for discussion -- and I think the board will improve.

Cpayne: Say what you will, I admitted that I was wrong about the skins missing the playoffs, and I gave the team and Joe Gibbs lots of credit for the end of year run, but when you're needing other teams to lose, it's far from an ideal situation. If you win the Super Bowl, you've done everything you need to. However, that doesn't mean you did everything right, regardless of who you are you can always improve.


I don't agree with this at all. It's often said the NFL is a what have you done for me lately league. That's how it works. I can't think of a single person who's basing the Gibbs of the 80s/90s. Everyone gives him the credit he's due. When he came back to the NFL I was very excited. I love Spurrier, I still think he could have won -- but it would require big changes, mainly to bringing some NFL experience into DC with his staff and to work on getting better players, something Gibbs did very well. However, when Gibbs did come in, I thought he would be an excellent coach. I knew he was a great leader, and had heard stories about his coaching prowess. I guess I slowly and slowly got upset with the sidelines thing. It's not because I want to "be cool". I do think that everything has changed so much from the 80s/90s to present. For instance, I think Gibbs' superbowl teams would struggle with a mediocre team today -- not because of Gibbs, players or coaching, just the advancements in technology, the bigger/stronger/faster athletes of today, etc. To me it wasn't a cool or uncool thing. It was a mix of seeing consistent progression and improvement that was lacking.

What I do when I look for the Redskins, is in good or bad see where we can improve. I often have less to say after a well played loss than a poorly played win. While the win is the most important thing, I don't understand why we can't look at a team and say this is where and why we have to improve. Win or loss.

This has gotten a bit more long winded than I meant, sorry. I'm just trying to explain myself a bit clearer. I feel often times I don't convey the message I mean to through my posts. Things I say are misconstrued or taken out of context. This is no ones fault but my own for not making things more concise. I don't 'hate' the team, I don't 'hate' Joe Gibbs. I just try to look at things from a balanced perspective -- or at least what I think is a balanced perspective.

I don't think anyone said it was ideal, but we were a legit 9 win team this year. Legit as in not particularly lucky. Legit as we played the 3rd toughest schedule after Philly and Buffalo. That's not ideal, but it is "good."

Ideally, we would be able to win the division...something we haven't done in the last 15 years. Winning the division is paramount to having a shot to win the super bowl.

However, we aren't quite at Dallas' level just yet, and that's not Gibbs' fault. At least not the job he's done on the sidelines. Dallas just has better overall talent than we do on both sides of the ball.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

I don't think anyone said it was ideal, but we were a legit 9 win team this year. Legit as in not particularly lucky. Legit as we played the 3rd toughest schedule after Philly and Buffalo. That's not ideal, but it is "good."

Ideally, we would be able to win the division...something we haven't done in the last 15 years. Winning the division is paramount to having a shot to win the super bowl.

However, we aren't quite at Dallas' level just yet, and that's not Gibbs' fault. At least not the job he's done on the sidelines. Dallas just has better overall talent than we do on both sides of the ball.

Actually we won the division in 99. It's been 8 LONG years.