How the draft looks if we trade down

[Lotus]

BTW I mentioned Leonard Williams but he is so very unlikely to fall to five that we are foolish to continue the discussion with him in it.

So the question is, who may there at five that we MUST have? And if the answer is, "no one," then why not trade down?

For me the two-cents answer is "no one," although a strong case can be made for Gregory.

[Irrefutable]

Originally Posted by Lotus

BTW I mentioned Leonard Williams but he is so very unlikely to fall to five that we are foolish to continue the discussion with him in it.

So the question is, who may there at five that we MUST have? And if the answer is, "no one," then why not trade down?

For me the two-cents answer is "no one," although a strong case can be made for Gregory.

If Leonard Williams or a QB falls to #5 then trade the pick for multiple draft choices.... it is going to take a lot of great picks, and free- agents to turn things around

[EARTHQUAKE2689]

Originally Posted by Lotus

BTW I mentioned Leonard Williams but he is so very unlikely to fall to five that we are foolish to continue the discussion with him in it.

So the question is, who may there at five that we MUST have? And if the answer is, "no one," then why not trade down?

For me the two-cents answer is "no one," although a strong case can be made for Gregory.

Leonard Williams could very well be there. Although you could make a case for Shane Ray as well. Tampa and Tennessee are likely to go QB, Jacksonville and Oakland are the main threats for him, Oakland specifically.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by EARTHQUAKE2689

Leonard Williams could very well be there. Although you could make a case for Shane Ray as well. Tampa and Tennessee are likely to go QB, Jacksonville and Oakland are the main threats for him, Oakland specifically.

You could be right and I understand your logic. I'm still miffed that we could have had JJ Watt but traded down instead.

I'm guessing, though, that Winston and Mariota will not be valued as highly by real teams as they are by the numerous draft sites which have them going at the top.

The QB's who were supposed to revolutionize the game: RGIII, Kaep, Newton, etc., have mostly struggled (Russell Wilson excepted). So I think more GM's will be cautious about drafting nontraditional QB's like Mariota or Winston. The game has caught up with the "running" QB.

Which is a long way of saying that I don't see Leonard Williams dropping to five. Just my two cents.

[EARTHQUAKE2689]

Originally Posted by Lotus

You could be right and I understand your logic. I'm still miffed that we could have had JJ Watt but traded down instead.

I'm guessing, though, that Winston and Mariota will not be valued as highly by real teams as they are by the numerous draft sites which have them going at the top.

The QB's who were supposed to revolutionize the game: RGIII, Kaep, Newton, etc., have mostly struggled (Russell Wilson excepted). So I think more GM's will be cautious about drafting nontraditional QB's like Mariota or Winston. The game has caught up with the "running" QB.

Which is a long way of saying that I don't see Leonard Williams dropping to five. Just my two cents.

Hopefully he is, him and Kerrigan would be our version of Justin and Aldon Smith

[hutch17]

Originally Posted by Lotus

You could be right and I understand your logic. I'm still miffed that we could have had JJ Watt but traded down instead.

I'm guessing, though, that Winston and Mariota will not be valued as highly by real teams as they are by the numerous draft sites which have them going at the top.

The QB's who were supposed to revolutionize the game: RGIII, Kaep, Newton, etc., have mostly struggled (Russell Wilson excepted). So I think more GM's will be cautious about drafting nontraditional QB's like Mariota or Winston. The game has caught up with the "running" QB.

Which is a long way of saying that I don't see Leonard Williams dropping to five. Just my two cents.

Because Kerrigan is such a huge drop off that the chance to pick up another good player is ridiculous. If you remember before he got hurt Jarvis Jenkins looked like a stud and, what would you say then is Kerrigan and a rock solid Jenkins not worh Watt, I think so. Especially with how much we did and still need help.

Trading back is the way to go now. we need to draft OG, RT, DT and S in that order. ( I think we might have a competent but not all pro in Compton at RT and our Gaurds are horendous, hopefully Long can stup up and we only need one)

[Monksdown]

BPA only works if you develop a formula to measure skill and secondary positions against linemen. That is a difficult proposition without a solid formula to establish a value rating system that allows all positions to remain on the same scale. I think rating systems like that are too arbitrary inherently and it's more important to draft from a weighted BPA system. you establish your needs in order, and then multiply the players grade's by the their positions weighted need within your predetermined 'needs'. This allows the best of both worlds. And if nothing else gives you a frame of reference when making intelligent decisions come draft day.

You need a Billy Bean kind of mind to run these figures for you.

[IrMitchell]

Originally Posted by Monksdown

BPA only works if you develop a formula to measure skill and secondary positions against linemen. That is a difficult proposition without a solid formula to establish a value rating system that allows all positions to remain on the same scale. I think rating systems like that are too arbitrary inherently and it's more important to draft from a weighted BPA system. you establish your needs in order, and then multiply the players grade's by the their positions weighted need within your predetermined 'needs'. This allows the best of both worlds. And if nothing else gives you a frame of reference when making intelligent decisions come draft day.

You need a Billy Bean kind of mind to run these figures for you.

If I've learned anything since following the Redskins, it's that every person (EXCEPT RB) has a direct correlation between high draft picks and success.

It's no surprise that Trent Williams/Chris Samuels are brilliant while guys like Tom Compton and the other 50 lineman drafted since aren't.

We could spend our fifth pick on any position and it may be enough to shift the talent level and chemistry and bring us to the next level.

EDIT: I guess what I'm trying to say is BPA means exactly what it should. Draft the player you think is the absolute best at his job. It's not easy to differentiate between guys when you have so many resources between tape, combines and practices.

[Monksdown]

Originally Posted by IrMitchell

If I've learned anything since following the Redskins, it's that every person (EXCEPT RB) has a direct correlation between high draft picks and success.

It's no surprise that Trent Williams/Chris Samuels are brilliant while guys like Tom Compton and the other 50 lineman drafted since aren't.

We could spend our fifth pick on any position and it may be enough to shift the talent level and chemistry and bring us to the next level.

EDIT: I guess what I'm trying to say is BPA means exactly what it should. Draft the player you think is the absolute best at his job. It's not easy to differentiate between guys when you have so many resources between tape, combines and practices.

I don't disagree with you at all. But I would argue that two B rated players in a team with multiple needs would have a greater impact on success than an A player.

[EARTHQUAKE2689]

Originally Posted by hutch17

Because Kerrigan is such a huge drop off that the chance to pick up another good player is ridiculous. If you remember before he got hurt Jarvis Jenkins looked like a stud and, what would you say then is Kerrigan and a rock solid Jenkins not worh Watt, I think so. Especially with how much we did and still need help.

Trading back is the way to go now. we need to draft OG, RT, DT and S in that order. ( I think we might have a competent but not all pro in Compton at RT and our Gaurds are horendous, hopefully Long can stup up and we only need one)

Everyone looks like a stud in pre season

[SFREDSKIN]

Alright, if there's an impact player like say a DT or DE you stay put and draft him. In the 2nd round if the next choice is equal to others then trade down a few spots and get more picks.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by SFREDSKIN

Alright, if there's an impact player like say a DT or DE you stay put and draft him. In the 2nd round if the next choice is equal to others then trade down a few spots and get more picks.

Not a bad strategy.