Who is Kirk Cousins?

[Buffalo Bob]

I am starting to get concerned how he struggles throwing out routes, that should not be an issue with a 4th year QB.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by Buffalo Bob

I am starting to get concerned how he struggles throwing out routes, that should not be an issue with a 4th year QB.

His arm is limited. Those type of throws just aren't his strength.

[Bucket]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

His arm is limited. Those type of throws just aren't his strength.

I don't agree with that Matt. I'm not sold Kirk is a starter, but his arm isn't limited. I've seen him make all the throws.

[30gut]

I think you're both right. Kirk can make all the throws. But from what I've seen his arm isn't strong enough to make those throws without perfect form. Imo he has to throw off platform from a muddy pocket or off balance etc. He doesn't have the arm strength in those situations to drive the ball with velocity and that causes him to spray passes off target (high,low, short, behind etc).

I also think the current emphasis on getting the ball out quick has Kirk playing close too hurried. I think Kirk is playing with an over emphasis on not taking sacks. Its good to get the ball out quick and beat the rush etc. But when you're rushing and it effects your footwork and you miss a wide open gimme throws (like the one he missed to Garcon in the flat on (iirc) 2nd and 2 in the Jets) then its a problem. Like Wooden said ~'be quick, but don't hurry'. Also, and maybe its mere co-incidence but I wonder if Griffin being active put Kirk on more pressure?

BUT part and parcel with Kirk's struggles is the coaching. The gameplan and playcalling remains predictable. In broad strokes without getting too far into the weeds; Jay's offense lacks disguise. By and large on first down if its a run he's going to use a formation that indicates run. I-Form or Single back usually with base personnel or 2/3 TEs. IF Jay drop back passes on 1st down its usually from a formation that he doesn't use to run. Shotgun 1 back or under center 3 wide or empty (and the pass is usually a screen). You know why defense seem to be all over the WR screen to Crowder on 1st down? Because its one of the only passes we run from that shotgun formation on 1st down.
Imho If they want to be a better run team they need to run the ball from some of the same formations, personnel and down and distance that they pass from.

TLDR: Jay's offense 1st down= run from base formations/base personnel.
IF Jay's offense comes out in a pass set on 1st down its going to be a pass.
Defenses have a good read on what's coming based on formations.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by 30gut

I think you're both right. Kirk can make all the throws. But from what I've seen his arm isn't strong enough to make those throws without perfect form. Imo he has to throw off platform from a muddy pocket or off balance etc. He doesn't have the arm strength in those situations to drive the ball with velocity and that causes him to spray passes off target (high,low, short, behind etc).

Excellent observation. And unfortunately he doesn't always keep his feet in the proper position even when not under pressure.

If you watch Rodgers and Brady they're extremely nifty with their feet, they slide around and escape pressure without really ever getting off balance. And even when they do a flick of the wrist is all they seem to need.

Of course, how hard is it to find a talent like that? We have one in Griffin. Too bad his brain doesn't work the same way.

[30gut]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

Excellent observation. And unfortunately he doesn't always keep his feet in the proper position even when not under pressure....

...Of course, how hard is it to find a talent like that? We have one in Griffin. Too bad his brain doesn't work the same way.

Correction. We had one; barring only the slimmest (although increasing with every poor performance from this HC/QB) will Griffin play for the Redskins again and if he does he still might be playing for a HC that doesn't want him.

Damn you for reminding me of the Griffin off balance flick of the wrist TDs.

Nothing speaks to the more to the dysfunction of this organization then the fall of Griffin. After Mike Shanny quit on the team/got fired they we're given a blank slate. But somehow they managed to find the one HC least capable/prepared/interested in developing what was then our greatest asset. Instead they found a HC that quit on him after 5 games; earlier according to the reports.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by 30gut

Correction. We had one; barring only the slimmest (although increasing with every poor performance from this HC/QB) will Griffin play for the Redskins again and if he does he still might be playing for a HC that doesn't want him.

Damn you for reminding me of the Griffin off balance flick of the wrist TDs.

Nothing speaks to the more to the dysfunction of this organization then the fall of Griffin. After Mike Shanny quit on the team/got fired they we're given a blank slate. But somehow they managed to find the one HC least capable/prepared/interested in developing what was then our greatest asset. Instead they found a HC that quit on him after 5 games; earlier according to the reports.

I don't want to turn this into a Griffin thread but I think his problems are just as much his own doing, or his own shortcomings, as it is the organization. Maybe even more so.

He's just not that quick witted. Ever take the DISC personality assessment? Griffin is an "I", a salesman, promotional, focused on how he's viewed. He's not analytical, and he's not decisive. He's fast as hell, and he can hit a target once it's open, that doesn't take a quick and decisive analytical mind and that's why he succeeded in college. It's also why he succeeded in year 1 under a college style offense designed by the Shanahans. But he expressed interest in moving on from a running style, but he doesn't have the wits. The surgical QBs - Brees, Manning, Brady, Rodgers, they are Ds/Cs. They are analytical, decisive, commanding, and attentive to detail.

Surgeons are Ds/Cs. Army commanders are Ds/Cs. Griffin is an I - he's a politician, a salesman, a public relations executive in an athlete's body.

He just doesn't have the right stuff. The only offense he'll succeed in is one that emphasizes his athleticism and keeps things simple enough that he doesn't have to bog down in details.

[Buffalo Bob]

Originally Posted by Bucket

I don't agree with that Matt. I'm not sold Kirk is a starter, but his arm isn't limited. I've seen him make all the throws.

I saw a written summary of Kirk's picks. I thought he had thrown 2 picks on
out routes but the summary (can't remember where I read it) described 3 of the 8 pics on out routes. Don't know if it is an arm strength issue but
too many times he throws those inside where they are ripe to turn into a pick six. Until the issue is corrected he needs to stop throwing them unless the receiver is wide open. A well thrown out is either caught by the receiver or uncatchable. Not the case for those thrown by Kirk.