AP Article: Redskins offense back to square one!

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by mheisig

Actually, Matty, that was just a "silly stat line."

I docked myself a few reputation points for using that "silly stat line."

I think you guys have drank waaaaaaaaaaay too much Joe Gibbs Kool Aid.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Don't forget to go along with that smashmouth style, we also had a pretty good passing game. Brunell was the 3rd rated passer in the NFC that year, and likely should have gone to the probowl, but they had to make room for the wonderful person that his Michael Vick, the 14th rated passer in the NFC, who was almost as efficient as Josh McCown.

This team just seems to be better on offense with an efficent running game, although the passing game needs to be clicking also.

In the first half of 2006, the rushing game was terrible, but the passing game kept us close (which is good because we were chasing because we were running the ball awful and playing crappy defense) against bad teams. Then we benched our QB and our passing game, but our rushing game found itself.

This year, the idea was going to be to put it back together like in 2005, but on the contrary, both aspect are crappy although for entirely different reasons.

The offense may very well need the running game to come back for the passing game to be effective. Our timing routes don't work. Period. I have no problem with the coaches trying to reestablish the running game as long as they try something new. The old crap from the last 6 games isn't going to work, and we are wasting plays trying it.

A QB's best friend is a competant running game, and Campbell doesn't have it right now for the first time in his college or pro career.

The 2005 offense stunk when it mattered most and that is why Sanders is here.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

I think you guys have drank waaaaaaaaaaay too much Joe Gibbs Kool Aid.

Because you can't form a coherent argument or because you are wrong? :cheeky-sm Kidding, of course.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

The 2005 offense stunk when it mattered most and that is why Sanders is here.

The 11th ranked offense was running over people left and right. That we faced teams with injured QBs (i.e., Rams and Eagles) has nothing to do with the offense's ability to run on opposing defenses. So it shouldn't come as a surprise when our starting tailback (who put up over 1,5000 yards) and our best run-blocking lineman (Randy Thomas) go down. So why is it that you don't consider our injuries as a defense for anything, but you make excuses for other teams' injuries?

The offense left a lot to be desired, but it was definitely good enough.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by Sheriff Gonna Getcha

Because you can't form a coherent argument or because you are wrong? :cheeky-sm Kidding, of course.

LOL! Do you guys watch other teams? Or are you just Redskin homers that don't see outside the box?

Look around. Alot of teams pass to set up the run. Alot of teams pass to loosen up the defense and then come back with the run later. We can't run so why try to play ball control and run the clock out instead of trying to maybe pass more to get more points? That running out the clock crap has lost us games. It almost lost the Ariz game and it lost the Giants game. It lost games in 05 and so on.

I was watching the Clev. game this past weekend and they made an consistent effort to get Braylon Edwards the ball downfield. Not throwing stupid little pussy ass screen passes that don't work. They threw it to him 15-30 yards downfield. Why aren't we doing this with Santana? He's our big play guy. Right? Is Clev any better than we are at the skill positions? They have a better line right now but we can still throw down field with our line. We just don't try to.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by Sheriff Gonna Getcha

The 11th ranked offense was running over people left and right. That we faced teams with injured QBs (i.e., Rams and Eagles) has nothing to do with the offense's ability to run on opposing defenses. So it shouldn't come as a surprise when our starting tailback (who put up over 1,5000 yards) and our best run-blocking lineman (Randy Thomas) go down. So why is it that you don't consider our injuries as a defense for anything, but you make excuses for other teams' injuries?

The offense left a lot to be desired, but it was definitely good enough.

Well apparently it was not good enough. It wasn't good enough in the playoffs was it? Is that the goal now? To just make the playoffs?

[mheisig]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

LOL! Do you guys watch other teams? Or are you just Redskin homers that don't see outside the box?

Look around. Alot of teams pass to set up the run. Alot of teams pass to loosen up the defense and then come back with the run later. We can't run so why try to play ball control and run the clock out instead of trying to maybe pass more to get more points? That running out the clock crap has lost us games. It almost lost the Ariz game and it lost the Giants game. It lost games in 05 and so on.

I was watching the Clev. game this past weekend and they made an consistent effort to get Braylon Edwards the ball downfield. Not throwing stupid little pussy ass screen passes that don't work. They threw it to him 15-30 yards downfield. Why aren't we doing this with Santana? He's our big play guy. Right? Is Clev any better than we are at the skill positions? They have a better line right now but we can still throw down field with our line. We just don't try to.

Yes, I watch plenty of games. I also have statistical, factual basis for my arguments rather than just spouting anecdotal nonsense.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

LOL! Do you guys watch other teams? Or are you just Redskin homers that don't see outside the box?

Look around. Alot of teams pass to set up the run. Alot of teams pass to loosen up the defense and then come back with the run later. We can't run so why try to play ball control and run the clock out instead of trying to maybe pass more to get more points? That running out the clock crap has lost us games. It almost lost the Ariz game and it lost the Giants game. It lost games in 05 and so on.

I was watching the Clev. game this past weekend and they made an consistent effort to get Braylon Edwards the ball downfield. Not throwing stupid little pussy ass screen passes that don't work. They threw it to him 15-30 yards downfield. Why aren't we doing this with Santana? He's our big play guy. Right? Is Clev any better than we are at the skill positions? They have a better line right now but we can still throw down field with our line. We just don't try to.

I'm not sure why you keep changing the issue. You said that this isn't the 1980s anymore and teams don't run to set up the pass. You were wrong, so now you are changing the question to "Can you pass to set up the run?" Yes they can, but that wasn't the issue you first posed.

BTW, implying that we are idiots who can't see out of the box and that you are laughing out loud at us isn't going to get you very far.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by mheisig

Yes, I watch plenty of games. I also have statistical, factual basis for my arguments rather than just spouting anecdotal nonsense.

So the whole Washington sports media and many former players that agree with my opinions are spouting anecdotal nonsense??? I'm just not a stat geek ( like you ) that lives and dies with numbers. Stats never tell the whole story.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

Well apparently it was not good enough. It wasn't good enough in the playoffs was it? Is that the goal now? To just make the playoffs?

It was good enough for the Ravens and Bucs - teams that relied on their defenses and running games to win the big ones. See I watch other teams.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

So the whole Washington sports media and many former players that agree with my opinions are spouting anecdotal nonsense??? I'm just not a stat geek ( like you ) that lives and dies with numbers. Stats never tell the whole story.

Everyone involved in this thread needs to chill. This thread is quickly headed to a lockdown.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by Sheriff Gonna Getcha

I'm not sure why you keep changing the issue. You said that this isn't the 1980s anymore and teams don't run to set up the pass. You were wrong, so now you are changing the question to "Can you pass to set up the run?" Yes they can, but that wasn't the issue you first posed.

BTW, implying that we are idiots who can't see out of the box and that you are laughing out loud at us isn't going to get you very far.

I said alot of teams pass to set up the run and those happen to be the best teams in the NFL. It's a copy cat league right?

BTW... Did I ever call you an idiot? No. I may call some people homers, Kool Aid drinkers and stat nerds but I don't attack people personally.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by Sheriff Gonna Getcha

Everyone involved in this thread needs to chill. This thread is quickly headed to a lockdown.

Dude I'm fine. Mheisig always seems to go out of his way to attack me. Calling me a crack head and a loser and what not.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

Dude I'm fine. Mheisig always seems to go out of his way to attack me. Calling me a crack head and a loser and what not.

Yup, that's why I said "everyone."

[Crazyhorse1]

Originally Posted by MTRedskinsFan

Yeah baby I like this article. Like djnemo65 said above it sort of reveals some guys have not bought into the play-calling/gameplan up to this pt (as if it wasn't obvious enough on gameday!). Who's to say whether they will totally buy in going forward, but it sounds like it should be a better situation going forward.

Also, the article referred to the hybrid offense. IMO this has been the biggest f'n problem. It's not really Gibbs' gameplan or Saunders gameplan but a weakened compromise. If either guy were to fully takeover the result would be better than what we've seen. My personal opinion is that Saunders full takeover will yield the very best results (if or when that actually happens), but for now if the offense is going to return more heavily to Gibbs style attack, w/ the whole o-line digging in for battle in the trenches, we should see some improvement. Gibbs is smashmouth, and hopefully it can be done w/ the players we have today. When Thomas gets back Gibbs' smashmouth will work even better. Meanwhile, Saunders relies on a rhythm of play-calling to constantly throw the defense off kilter (remember KC). His style probably requires a higher level of execution and for everyone to be onboard, but I think in today's NFL it can be more effective than the smashmouth.

We have no ability whatsoever to play smashmouth football. Our OL is weak and old and fragile. We're sure to get our butts kicked and lose a couple more players, including Portis. We're even terrible on short yardage and have been for years, even before half our line got knocked out. If I were a DL or LB I would be dying to play us right now-- especially after this macho nonsense about the running game. DL's are much more physical than our OL, which can't move or split the D line.

I'd rather play the whole game in a two minute offense rather than try to sustain drives on the ground with our current personnel. We're going to see a lot of three and outs.