The Vinny and the Scouts Appreciation Thread

[SmootSmack]

Last year I made a point of saying that Cerrato and his team of scouts needed to step up and unearth hidden gems. I think maybe it's time for me to retract that statement. We've rightfully praised Snyder for doing whatever the team has needed under duress this season (Sean Taylor's funeral, Todd Collins being there for the birth of his daughter, and Gibbs for holding the team together when all hope seemed lost (as he has done so many times in his career. But what about the third member of the triumvirate? Should we start giving some more credit to Cerrato?

Sure we've made mistakes, but look at the guys we've "unearthed" that have stepped up huge this year: Heyer has held down the RT spot not even a full year after being undrafted out of college; Lorenzo Alexander has done everything short of drive the team bus, Leigh Torrence has markedly improve the past two weeks to be a dependable nickel (still has a ways to go, but he's getting there); Reed Doughty has overcome the serious illness of his son along with the burden of replacing Sean Taylor and, with the help of Williams and Gray, has been able to maximize his strengths and be a solid starter on defense; late picks Golston and Montgomery have held down the interior allowing "no names" like Chris Wilson, Khary Campbell, and H.B. Blades to make plays...and so on.

Anyway what I'm getting at, and piggybacking off a post that skinsfan69 has, is let's not overlook the impact Cerrato and the scouting team has had on putting together the 53 man roster that we've had to dig deep into this season to make the playoffs

[That Guy]

they're also part of the reason we have guys like brandon lloyd and rocky's bum knees :/

drafting has been better, and they're moving into the more good than harm area, but this isn't pioli territory here.

[MTK]

This article points to our quality depth, gotta give it up for the front office:

washingtonpost.com

[TheMalcolmConnection]

Ah, come on, let's not bash Rocky for basically tearing every ligament in an injury that hits a lot of people. If he had healthy knees, it wasn't like he was going to be fine with the injury he got.

[SmootSmack]

Leave it to That Guy to put a downer on things.

As I said, we've certainly made our mistakes but all so many of us do is constantly bash every single move the front office makes (and by front office I really mean Cerrato) and I was just trying to say there's more than just Lloyd and Duckett. They have done some good, and I thought it should be pointed out.

[killromo]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

...there's more than just Lloyd and Duckett. They have done some good, and I thought it should be pointed out.

I thought we only picked up duckett to keep him from going to philly? We've got some no-namers doing better than could ever be expected and someone deserves a little credit for that, why not Vinny?

[Bill B]

As long as the team keeps moving away from trying to "win the offseason championship" they are going in the right direction. I am hoping that after years of trying to buy the "biggest" free agent players that eventually proved to be disappointing the team has finally learned that this formula cannot bread consistent winners.

As far as giving credit to Cerrato - I admit that I am not a Cerrato supporter - never have been. I read a lot of on the net and often I hear NFL insiders not give to much credit when Cerrato's name comes up. I think you have to look not only at Gibbs II but the entire time Cerrato has been here. Since 2000 we have qualified for the playoffs 2 times in 7 years - is that something to hang your hat on? And also the two times we did qualify for the were under Gibbs, the times we qualified without Gibbs and while Cerrato was here - zero.

So I ask this: if you were a NFL owner building your team from the ground up how many of you would actually sign Vinny to be the architect of your team - I know I wouldn't.

[freddyg12]

Originally Posted by Bill B

As long as the team keeps moving away from trying to "win the offseason championship" they are going in the right direction. I am hoping that after years of trying to buy the "biggest" free agent players that eventually proved to be disappointing the team has finally learned that this formula cannot bread consistent winners.

As far as giving credit to Cerrato - I admit that I am not a Cerrato supporter - never have been. I read a lot of on the net and often I hear NFL insiders not give to much credit when Cerrato's name comes up. I think you have to look not only at Gibbs II but the entire time Cerrato has been here. Since 2000 we have qualified for the playoffs 2 times in 7 years - is that something to hang your hat on? And also the two times we did qualify for the were under Gibbs, the times we qualified without Gibbs and while Cerrato was here - zero.

So I ask this: if you were a NFL owner building your team from the ground up how many of you would actually sign Vinny to be the architect of your team - I know I wouldn't.

I agree w/your 1st paragraph, my previous post says about the same (which I was typing about the time you posted).

As for Vinny, do any of us really have any idea of what his influence is on personel & other matters? Is it true that he's Danny's mouthpiece & glorified gopher? With Snyder so involved in contracts & the organization so intent on being secretive it seems awfully hard to really assess Vinny.

On the other hand, it's not been hard at all to assess the overall organization under DS. It's been obvious to all of us that there's been a need for a change to their methods of acquiring players for years. Now it seems that the change is underway. We'll see for sure this offseason.

[MTK]

With what this team has accomplished and how they have done it, I really don't see much room for bitching and complaining.

Let's give credit where it's due.

[Defensewins]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

With what this team has accomplished and how they have done it, I really don't see much room for bitching and complaining.

Let's give credit where it's due.

I am all for giving credit to where it is due, but lets not forget this success seems small coming behind 6 or 7 years of some really poor talent evalution of lower round picks and free agents. I do not think there is anything wrong with pointing out how bad the drafting lower round picks and free agents (non-drafted) players has been. I mean really bad. It is not "bitching and complaining" when I am merely giving a different view point.
I give most of the credit to the new found success of finding hidden gems to Gibbs and not Cerratto. The success started when Gibbs and co, arrived. Cerrato has his own track record before Gibbs got here and it is not pretty.
We had the highest payroll $ and one of the lower performing teams.
The proof was on the field every Sunday. I do not care how talented our team appeared on paper.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by Defensewins

I am all for giving credit to where it is due, but lets not forget this success seems small coming behind 6 or 7 years of some really poor talent evalution of lower round picks and free agents. I do not think there is anything wrong with pointing out how bad the drafting lower round picks and free agents (non-drafted) players has been. I mean really bad. It is not "bitching and complaining" when I am merely giving a different view point.
I give most of the credit to the new found success of finding hidden gems to Gibbs and not Cerratto. The success started when Gibbs and co, arrived. Cerrato has his own track record before Gibbs got here and it is not pretty.
We had the highest payroll $ and one of the lower performing teams.
The proof was on the field every Sunday. I do not care how talented our team appeared on paper.

Ok then, should I change this thread title to "Is it time to stop harping on Desmond Howard and give Gibbs credit for his personnel evaluation skills?"

[skinsnut]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Ok then, should I change this thread title to "Is it time to stop harping on Desmond Howard and give Gibbs credit for his personnel evaluation skills?"

I would agree with that...not only is Gibbs pretty good....but based on the last 2 years, he is getting better and better.

[skinsnut]

Originally Posted by Defensewins

I am all for giving credit to where it is due, but lets not forget this success seems small coming behind 6 or 7 years of some really poor talent evalution of lower round picks and free agents. I do not think there is anything wrong with pointing out how bad the drafting lower round picks and free agents (non-drafted) players has been. I mean really bad. It is not "bitching and complaining" when I am merely giving a different view point.
I give most of the credit to the new found success of finding hidden gems to Gibbs and not Cerratto. The success started when Gibbs and co, arrived. Cerrato has his own track record before Gibbs got here and it is not pretty.
We had the highest payroll $ and one of the lower performing teams.
The proof was on the field every Sunday. I do not care how talented our team appeared on paper.

Keep in mind...someone has to COACH the players....do you think HEYER would be successful without BUGES?
What about Montgomery and Golston?

Its the combination of a solid coaching staff's influence on who to target combined with daily work....especially with "less talented" players.
Spurrier did not have that ability...nor did Norv or Marty.
Spurrier makes his players look worse, Norv can only make his offensive players play to their potential and Marty....well....he likes to punt a lot.

[Defensewins]

Originally Posted by skinsnut

Keep in mind...someone has to COACH the players....do you think HEYER would be successful without BUGES?
What about Montgomery and Golston?

Its the combination of a solid coaching staff's influence on who to target combined with daily work....especially with "less talented" players.
Spurrier did not have that ability...nor did Norv or Marty.
Spurrier makes his players look worse, Norv can only make his offensive players play to their potential and Marty....well....he likes to punt a lot.

Yes I agree. But is it not the the job and responsibility of the Owner and Front Office to hire the coaching staff as well as draft the players?
So either way the Owner and FO made some decisions that did not work out and cost us some poor seasons.

[skinsnut]

Originally Posted by Defensewins

Yes I agree. But is it not the the job and responsibility of the Owner and Front Office to hire the coaching staff as well as draft the players?
So either way the Owner and FO made some decisions that did not work out and cost us some poor seasons.

True...the best move the front office ever made was this.

They heaviliy recruited and rehire Joe Gibbs and have let him heavily influence most FO decisions