Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate

[Hog1]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

Listen, I won't go tit for tat on what the Obama's said or meant to say, so called affiliations and such.

IMO, why are we not asking these questions.........with eyes open.......of all the candidates? Why do we not scrutinize the people our candidates have associated with in the past? Why are we not paying close attention to all aspects past and present of our candidates?
To many people want to brush these things aside as meaningless. I do not, and I will tell you now, O'bama has some disturbing associations that concern me "as an American". Naturally, he would like to talk about...change, and not about "God-Damn America".....who can blame him.
If MCcain does or his running mate, I damn sure want to heavily scrutinize those as well. To look the other way is irresponsible
I would think all Americans would want to know in detail as we all live here and I assume all want basically the same thing?

[724Skinsfan]

Originally Posted by saden1

John McCain is a leader and a capable one at that. He graduated from the Naval Academy and can be trusted with the Red Button.

What Red Button?

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by Hog1

IMO, why are we not asking these questions.........with eyes open.......of all the candidates? Why do we not scrutinize the people our candidates have associated with in the past? Why are we not paying close attention to all aspects past and present of our candidates?
To many people want to brush these things aside as meaningless. I do not, and I will tell you now, O'bama has some disturbing associations that concern me "as an American". Naturally, he would like to talk about...change, and not about "God-Damn America".....who can blame him.
If MCcain does or his running mate, I damn sure want to heavily scrutinize those as well. To look the other way is irresponsible
I would think all Americans would want to know in detail as we all live here and I assume all want basically the same thing?

Oh, I'm more than willing to answer them. In fact, they have been answered. I just didn't want to get into argument with 4mrusmc.

Hog1, based on what you know about me (whatever that may be), if I played you a clip of me, 12thMan, saying God damn America. What would your honest conclusion be?

[Hog1]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

Oh, I'm more than willing to answer them. In fact, they have been answered. I just didn't want to get into argument with 4mrusmc.

Hog1, based on what you know about me (whatever that may be), if I played you a clip of me, 12thMan, saying God damn America. What would your honest conclusion be?

I am not tainting your reputation but, if you were an apparent 20 year associate of a presidential candidate in my country who I would assume has sought council at your side from time to time, I would be concerned. I do not condemn anyone for allegations from anyone, but it does get my attention.
BTW, it is not in your power to answer them. Only O' can do that

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by Hog1

I am not tainting your reputation but, if you were an apparent 20 year associate of a presidential candidate in my country who I would assume has sought council at your side from time to time, I would be concerned. I do not condemn anyone for allegations from anyone, but it does get my attention.
BTW, it is not in your power to answer them. Only O' can do that

So I take it you think I'm an okay guy?

But seriously, I've heard O answer and address these concernes at least 10 or 15 times, and I must say, I'm honestly satisfied. Especially his affiliation with William Ayers. But to your point, it is/was a reason to be concerned.

[djnemo65]

So Palin's 17 year old daughter is pregnant. Personally, I don't consider this to be a story at all but people are talking about it so there you go. http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/02/us...hp&oref=slogin

[hesscl34]

Originally Posted by djnemo65

So Palin's 17 year old daughter is pregnant. Personally, I don't consider this to be a story at all but people are talking about it so there you go. http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/02/us...hp&oref=slogin

Not a story? .... I'm sure it's quite a story for that 17 year old girl who just had her news spread all over the country/world...

[djnemo65]

Originally Posted by hesscl34

Not a story? .... I'm sure it's quite a story for that 17 year old girl who just had her news spread all over the country/world...

Huh? Are you saying that you don't think this should have received the media attention it has? Because if you are we agree. And if you aren't then I really have no idea what you are talking about.

[dmek25]

the only reason it became a story, is because there were reports that her 5 month old son was conceived by her daughter

[wolfeskins]

i wish g.w.bush could remain pres. for another 8 years. he's done a fine job.

[12thMan]

Believe me, this is far from a non-story. Through the prism of our every day ordinary lives, yes, it's a non-story and should be none of our business. But this will impact the race, no doubt. Obama, Biden, and McCain have been dragged through the media since they started running for office over a year ago, and now it's Palin turn. I really hate it.

Unfortuntately this is where we are with our politics these days. Nothing and no one is off limits. I was glad to see Obama put the media in check and told them to back off the Palin story and leave it alone.

[4mrusmc]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

Okay, I can dig that. But that definition is a little too abstract for me. What about those who don't or can't serve in the military. How are they to prove their love or defend our country? Surely that would leave out hundreds of millions of Americans, wouldn't it? Another thing, since you cite the Declaration of Independence, The Constitution, The Bill of Rights, how does the institution of slavery factor into this and more recently, the Jim Crow era, as it relates to our founding fathers and their ideals of sacracfice and service?

I'm not trying to stir the pot, just trying to see exactly when did America start loving and defending other Americans - all Americans.

12th, let me for one say that I am glad that we are having this discussion about impotant things that we feel very passionate about. Discussions like this will only educate people. And that is how we can learn more about each other.

Now to comment about your above post. As far as those who do not or can't serve our military. I don't have a problem with those people. And I didn't say that was a prerequisite to becoming commander-in-chief. But, my beef is with those people who are disrespectful to the flag and our country with their words and deeds.

Also, my parents would say that you know alot about a person by the type of people that they hang around. And all that I said earlier is that I think Obama hangs out with some suspect people who I think are influential to his thinking.

You referenced the institution of slavery. Let me be one of the many people to say that that was a terrible thing that happened in our nations past. And unfortunately that was going on before our nation really had a solvent government. Still this does not excuse it at all. It is however too bad that it has taken us hundreds of years to really get the We The People thing right.

[Hog1]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

So I take it you think I'm an okay guy?

But seriously, I've heard O answer and address these concernes at least 10 or 15 times, and I must say, I'm honestly satisfied. Especially his affiliation with William Ayers. But to your point, it is/was a reason to be concerned.

Obviously, I do not know you, and have little to make a decision with.
I would expect O' to provide as good an answer to these questions as he can muster! and tout them at EVERY oppurtunity. You would not expect less. I am sure.
Unfortunately, I think many do not take such a responsible approach as yourself

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by 4mrusmc

12th, let me for one say that I am glad that we are having this discussion about impotant things that we feel very passionate about. Discussions like this will only educate people. And that is how we can learn more about each other.

Now to comment about your above post. As far as those who do not or can't serve our military. I don't have a problem with those people. And I didn't say that was a prerequisite to becoming commander-in-chief. But, my beef is with those people who are disrespectful to the flag and our country with their words and deeds.

Also, my parents would say that you know alot about a person by the type of people that they hang around. And all that I said earlier is that I think Obama hangs out with some suspect people who I think are influential to his thinking.

You referenced the institution of slavery. Let me be one of the many people to say that that was a terrible thing that happened in our nations past. And unfortunately that was going on before our nation really had a solvent government. Still this does not excuse it at all. It is however too bad that it has taken us hundreds of years to really get the We The People thing right.

I didn't bring up slavery to make anyway feel sorry, but that it's just a chapter, a big chapter, of our nation's history. And as great as our Constitution is, we as a nation have, at times, struggled to reconcile our history of injustice and the what the Constitution stands for.

As far as Obama's friends or buddies. It's well documented that when Ayer's committed whatever it is he's accused of, Obama was eight years old. Had Obama been a friend of Ayer's at that time and espoused those same beliefs and actions, then I'd have a major problem with it. But he doesn't. This man, while still a little off his rocker, just isn't one of his close friends or colleagues. And if we are going to judge one relationship, then let's judge them in the context of all of his relationships.

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by dmek25

this pick was strictly politics as usual. reaching out for the Hilliary supporters. the first thing i thought was, is this the best they could do? with her lack of experience, she makes Obama look worldly. there is no way in hell i want her one step away from running my country. almost laughable

I guess that Obama's pick was one of politics and just more of the same as we have gotten from Biden and his spending for years. It seems that the dems are scared of McCains pick and the lack of Obamas movment in the polls behind thier convention. Even Kerry had a 7% jump in the polls after his convention and Obama's didn't move at all. We still hear his call for change but see the same old Biden as his VP.