Don't you think we are overreacting just a bit??

[Stacks42]

Originally Posted by DirtyLandry

Campbell was horrible?? an 81.6 passer rating is horrible? And did you just compare him to Farve? Eli manning might have had more yards but had a far worse passer rating and threw an interception (probably should have been 5 picks.) People like you are why it's hard to be a skins fan.

If you think Campbell had a great game, than you must be drinking the kool-aid from the fire hose!

[MTK]

Originally Posted by Defensewins

I am not amazed. After spending an entire off season reading post here on TWP of a certain group of very overly optimistic fans saying we were a top team in the NFC east, I was expecting this to happen. I was expecting this kind of reaction from fans. These are the same fans that cried foul when the 'so called' professional prognosticators had us coming in last or next to last in the NFC east this season.

What has me frustrated is I did not like some of the moves that were made this off season and I expected the team to regress in the short term future. But I at the same time I look for some consistent level of play and discipline in the fundamentals. What I saw in the preseason and game 1 is we regressed in this measure.
I just want to see our team, especially on defense, play well. Even if we do not win. We are going to beat lesser teams, but i want to see us play to a certain standard, even if we lose to a better team.
We are currently not doing that and that is what has me frustrated. To read post of people saying our defense played well in game 1 frustrates me. To my eye of what is a good defense, our defense did not play well and truthfully is not very good.
When our defense gives up 5.1 yds a carry, we will not win many games or make the playoffs. Plain and simple. That was not good defense regardless of the score.
This was an above average playoff team last year. We are currently not as good as were last year, I think I can be disappointed and frustrated in the level of play.

Was the defense really the problem though?

They tightened up in the 2nd half (42 yard rushing allowed vs. 74 in the first half) and kept us in the game and only allowed 1 TD. If we had any hint of an offense that was a very winnable game.

Yes the D needs some improvement, but I'm not sure why you are so focused on them vs. the offense, which needs a vast improvement.

[Stacks42]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Was the defense really the problem though?

They tightened up in the 2nd half (42 yard rushing allowed vs. 74 in the first half) and kept us in the game and only allowed 1 TD. If we had any hint of an offense that was a very winnable game.

Yes the D needs some improvement, but I'm not sure why you are so focused on them vs. the offense, which needs a vast improvement.

I said earlier in this thread that the D looked bad, but I agree that they will pick it up. The first half was not good for them, but they were on the field nearly the whole half. When Springs comes back and Rogers, McIntosh as well as Landry get their "football legs" under them, the D will be just fine.

[Redskin Warrior]

Originally Posted by Stacks42

If you think Campbell had a great game, than you must be drinking the kool-aid from the fire hose!

I don't think he had a great game but he was decent considering the play of the o-line & receivers

[GoSkins!]

Are we over-reacting

Yes

• To say that the QB needs to go and that Zorn should be replaced is definitely over-reacting.

No

• To say that we have looked flat for three games and that the primary responsibility of that lies on the coach is a reasonable reaction.
• To say Campbell shouldn't be staring down his receivers is reasonable.
• To say that 4 completions on third down that all fall short of a first down is unacceptable is a valid opinion.
• To say that clock management was terrible even for a high school coach and QB is just a factual observation.

For me, personally, I believe that since Snyder picked a QB coach with no real HC experience, new offensive system, and a young QB, we have to have a long leash. I'll give Zorn all year as long as I see some basic progress being made and see him stand strong under adversity. What I have had a hard time stomaching is him calling out guys in public and not taking responsibility himself. Now that he has finally done that (in his Friday press conference and player meetings), I feel much more confident that he will adjust to the players some, work on himself, and still hold guys to a high standard. Owning up is rule number one for being a true leader.
Glad to see he finally did it...

[MTK]

Originally Posted by GoSkins!

The answer is yes and no.
Are we over-reacting?
Yes - To say that the QB needs to go and that Zorn should be replaced is definitely over-reacting.
No - To say that we have looked flat for three games and that the primary responsibility of that lies on the coach is a reasonable reaction.
To say Campbell shouldn't be staring down his receivers is reasonable. To say that 4 completions on third down that all fall short of a first down is unacceptable is a valid opinion. To say that clock management was terrible even for a high school coach and QB is just a factual observation.

For me, personally, I believe that since Snyder picked a QB coach with no real HC experience, new offensive system, and a young QB, we have to have a long leash. I'll give Zorn all year as long as I see some basic progress being made and see him stand strong under adversity. What I have had a hard time stomaching is him calling out guys in public and not taking responsibility himself. Now that he has finally done that (in his Friday press conference and player meetings), I feel much more confident that he will adjust to the players some, work on himself, and still hold guys to a high standard. Owning up is rule number one for being a true leader.
Glad to see he finally did it...

Finally? He's been pretty candid about shouldering blame and what his responsibilities are as head coach from day one.

[GMScud]

My big problem wasn't that we got beaten, it was where we got beaten. We were flat out pushed around in the trenches on both sides of the ball. Redskins football is supposed to be the other way around. The offensive line had a poor preseason, and Thursday didn't help my feelings on that. We've already seen Jansen get benched, and Casey got manhandled. We had no push in the run game.

And the defensive line just doesn't look like a tough group. They were about as solid as wet toilet paper.

If we don't turn things around on the line of scrimmage, it's going to be a long painful season.

As far as fans overreacting, what else is new? The way the game ended was a joke, and I do understand the outrage over that . Zorn has been around the NFL for over 30 years. Did he miss the memo stating there is no such thing as a 3 point conversion? How do we not kick a field goal and go for an onsides kick?

Anway, as fans we should be smart enough not to give up on the coach, the team, and the season after one bad game. I was listening to Czaban (yes I'm a glutton for punishment) yesterday, and some of the callers were just pathetic. One lady suggested all the fans boycott the games and pickett outside FedEx field. Another guy said we'll go 3-13, fire Zorn, and hire Cowher. Come on people.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Defensewins

I am not amazed. After spending an entire off season reading post here on TWP of a certain group of very overly optimistic fans saying we were a top team in the NFC east, I was expecting this to happen. I was expecting this kind of reaction from fans. These are the same fans that cried foul when the 'so called' professional prognosticators had us coming in last or next to last in the NFC east this season.

What has me frustrated is I did not like some of the moves that were made this off season and I expected the team to regress in the short term future. But I at the same time I look for some consistent level of play and discipline in the fundamentals. What I saw in the preseason and game 1 is we regressed in this measure.
I just want to see our team, especially on defense, play well. Even if we do not win. We are going to beat lesser teams, but i want to see us play to a certain standard, even if we lose to a better team.
We are currently not doing that and that is what has me frustrated. To read post of people saying our defense played well in game 1 frustrates me. To my eye of what is a good defense, our defense did not play well and truthfully is not very good.
When our defense gives up 5.1 yds a carry, we will not win many games or make the playoffs. Plain and simple. That was not good defense regardless of the score.
This was an above average playoff team last year. We are currently not as good as were last year, I think I can be disappointed and frustrated in the level of play.

Good post.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Stacks42

15 of 27 55.6% for 133 yds an average of 4.9 yd per play, yes that is horrible. Great to have a awesome passer rating when all you are doing is dumping the ball off, didn't Brunell set some type of completion record a couple years ago doing the same thing?
My comparison to farve was in how he would fair with the learning curve, they are completly different QBs. I was just saying if you have been working on something for 6 months, you should be able to show something.

Yeah, I agree with you that his statline shows that Campbell was inefficient/ineffective, but shouldn't "horrible" imply a few critical INTs...much less no INTs?

[Paintrain]

Originally Posted by GMScud

My big problem wasn't that we got beaten, it was where we got beaten. We were flat out pushed around in the trenches on both sides of the ball. Redskins football is supposed to be the other way around. The offensive line had a poor preseason, and Thursday didn't help my feelings on that. We've already seen Jansen get benched, and Casey got manhandled. We had no push in the run game.

And the defensive line just doesn't look like a tough group. They were about as solid as wet toilet paper.

If we don't turn things around on the line of scrimmage, it's going to be a long painful season.

As far as fans overreacting, what else is new? The way the game ended was a joke, and I do understand the outrage over that . Zorn has been around the NFL for over 30 years. Did he miss the memo stating there is no such thing as a 3 point conversion? How do we not kick a field goal and go for an onsides kick?

Anway, as fans we should be smart enough not to give up on the coach, the team, and the season after one bad game. I was listening to Czaban (yes I'm a glutton for punishment) yesterday, and some of the callers were just pathetic. One lady suggested all the fans boycott the games and pickett outside FedEx field. Another guy said we'll go 3-13, fire Zorn, and hire Cowher. Come on people.

First of all Matty, good original post, excellent points that everyone needs to just calm the f*ck down. If we beat NO next Sunday at home, all of the sudden we've knocked off a leading NFC contender and may be on the way towards a surprise season..

Now, to the bolded part of the quote, I'm sick and tired of hearing about 'Redskins football is' blah blah blah.. We're like the only franchise/fan base rooted in the mentality of the past. Is 'Patriots football' winging it around the field because that's what they've done for 40 years? No, it's because their talent dictates it and they win. 'Packer football' was a tough grind it out team that would physically bludgeon you, until Brett Favre started slinging it downfield and they started winning.

Bottom line, whatever makes you a winner with the talent you have, that's 'your football'. To paraphrase Rick Pitino-Joe Jacoby isn't walking thru that door folks, Russ Grimm isn't walking thru that door, John Riggins isn't walking thru that door. Either we win or lose with the talent we have but shoehorning our team into 'Redskins football' is just sports talk radio fodder.

[Redskin Warrior]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Yeah, I agree with you that his statline shows that Campbell was inefficient/ineffective, but shouldn't "horrible" imply a few critical INTs...much less no INTs?

I 2nd that

[WaldSkins]

At least we didn't hear the "they fought their guts out speech".

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by Paintrain

First of all Matty, good original post, excellent points that everyone needs to just calm the f*ck down. If we beat NO next Sunday at home, all of the sudden we've knocked off a leading NFC contender and may be on the way towards a surprise season..

Now, to the bolded part of the quote, I'm sick and tired of hearing about 'Redskins football is' blah blah blah.. We're like the only franchise/fan base rooted in the mentality of the past. Is 'Patriots football' winging it around the field because that's what they've done for 40 years? No, it's because their talent dictates it and they win. 'Packer football' was a tough grind it out team that would physically bludgeon you, until Brett Favre started slinging it downfield and they started winning.

Bottom line, whatever makes you a winner with the talent you have, that's 'your football'. To paraphrase Rick Pitino-Joe Jacoby isn't walking thru that door folks, Russ Grimm isn't walking thru that door, John Riggins isn't walking thru that door. Either we win or lose with the talent we have but shoehorning our team into 'Redskins football' is just sports talk radio fodder.

You're absolutely correct about winning with the talent you have, and how you win is certainly "your football." That doesn't mean there can't be a sense of pride about a tradition surrounding your team. Success on any team starts at the line of scrimmage, particularly the offensive line, and all of our past achievements featured strong OL's. Also, we've got one of the best O-line coaches in league history. Bugel is a huge reason the phrase "Redskins Football" exists.

Would it make you feel better if I just say, "the offesive line is supposed to be a big part of our identity as a team?" That's really all I mean when I say "Redskins Football."

[WaldSkins]

The biggest problems i got from this game was:

* I thought that we should have been blitzing a lot more.
* JC staring down his receivers and throwing to short on third downs.
* Poor clock management.
* Running on first and long, second and long, and throwing only on third and long early in the game.


All these can be fixed with some more game time for this team and its rookie head coach. I think a lot of people are just so upset because they know how hard our first five games are and how we need to start out on a good start.

[drew54]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Was the defense really the problem though?

They tightened up in the 2nd half (42 yard rushing allowed vs. 74 in the first half) and kept us in the game and only allowed 1 TD. If we had any hint of an offense that was a very winnable game.

Yes the D needs some improvement, but I'm not sure why you are so focused on them vs. the offense, which needs a vast improvement.

I have always felt if you cannot score 21 points you dont deserve to win.

Defense gave up 16, that should be a winnable game 100% of the time.