Execution Sucks!

skinsguy · 11-21-2004, 10:15 PM

Figured I'd try my best to even out the Joe Gibbs witch hunt threads. The reason why we're 3-7 right now is for many reasons and to say it's sloely Joe Gibbs is just completely wrong. We've had injuries...our top players out for most if not all the season; Brunell has been a dissappointment...our receivers have been inconsistant...execution overall has not been consistant. Yes Joe Gibbs play calling hasn't been golden all the time...ya know this is his first season back in 12 years...what do you expect? He's working out the kinks. Its' trial and error for him right now and some of the errors make him look pathetic, while some of the positives make him look like a genius.

Its not one thing that has made us 3-7, it's many things, but its things that can be corrected by next season...Gibbs said he's going to find out who are Redskins players and who are not...Maybe he thought all along of this season being a rebuilding season. Maybe it's possible that the play calling right now is merely just an audtion?? Whatever it is, Gibbs isn't the problem.

Sheriff Gonna Getcha · 11-21-2004, 10:21 PM

#1 Gibbs was the guy who went after Brunell so hard. Doesn't he share in the blame for that?

#2 Most of our injuries have affected our defense and our defense is ranked #2 whereas our offense is ranked #31 (in scoring).

#3 Jon Jansen was the only starter out on offense until today (when Thomas got hurt).

#4 If the players aren't executing, as head coach, doesn't Gibbs get some of the blame for that?

#5 Gibbs isn't the sole reason for our record, but he's the head coach. He picked his staff, he chose our roster (i.e. Brunell), and he coaches the players. To absolve him of blame is just wrong.

MTK · 11-21-2004, 10:23 PM

LOL so much for that

1 post and we're back on pushing the blame on Gibbs.

Gmanc711 · 11-21-2004, 10:25 PM

To absolve blame Gibbs of blame is wrong, I agree. To place the blame soley on him is wong as well. Theres gotta be some middle ground here. Maybe were not as patient as we are telling others (media) to be. Gibbs is obviously struggling finding a offense. I think he just has to relize that in todays NFL, we cant just play everything safe. We have to gamble, which will pay off and hurt us at the same time. In some situations, it will be the difference for a win, in others a loss. We cant play like we did today ( playcalling) and expect to win. All of the blame isnt on him, and people would be crazy to say it is, but some of it absolutley falls on him.

Sheriff Gonna Getcha · 11-21-2004, 10:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

LOL so much for that

1 post and we're back on pushing the blame on Gibbs.

Why would we blame Gibbs? It's not like he's the head coach or anything.

PS-You guys jumped on me in my thread so it was only fair for me to come into yours.

skinsguy · 11-21-2004, 10:30 PM

Gibbs picks his players yet there is only one name mentioned..nobody has mentioned Portis, Sean Taylor, Griffin, Springs....new players that have been positive for us. Ramsey sucked in the preseason and Brunell played better...it came down to Brunell not doing his job in the regular season...that falls on Brunell....again EXECUTION. If the players aren't executing, how can you blame the coach? Why is it Gibbs' fault that Ramsey over throws a wide open Coles down the field?

Certainly Gibbs isn't the sole reason and yeah he's made some mistakes and some bad play calling and he'll tell you that himself. Yet, it gets rather unbelieveable when we blame the coaches on execution...they are not the ones playing on the field.

MTK · 11-21-2004, 10:30 PM

ugh how many times do I have to say Gibbs deserves some criticism?

I'd just like to see a more even argument here. Seems like we're piling on Gibbs and overlooking what the players are doing, or not doing to be more specific.

Sheriff Gonna Getcha · 11-21-2004, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

ugh how many times do I have to say Gibbs deserves some criticism?

I'd just like to see a more even argument here. Seems like we're piling on Gibbs and overlooking what the players are doing, or not doing to be more specific.

Matty, why can't you admit that Gibbs deserves some of the criticism.

djnemo65 · 11-21-2004, 10:34 PM

I completely agree with your assessment ramseyfan. I would also add that its not just that the play calling has been at times spotty, but it was today completely inexplicable. i think it was ambrose bierce who said that the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results, and that's my attitude towards Gibbs' stubborn playcalling. Playaction passes on first down were sitting there for us to take, especially early, and we kept just plugging Portis up the middle, as if he's Jerome Bettis.

And what hurts me most is the lack of improvement on offense. I thought ramsey did well and made alot of throws that brunell certainly would not have, but there is a larger problem in gameplanning that persists. Also, someone needs to tell Gibbs that third and three is not a running down in today's NFL. How many times this year have we been stuffed in that situation.

Gibbs started 0-5 his first year but rapidly improved after that. We started 1-4, and yet seem no better offensively then we were against Tampa Bay. For me the sparkle of those three past Lombardi trophies has faded, and my attitude is now show me. show me you can move the ball. show me you can adjust your gameplan to what the defense gives you. show me you understand the nuances of todays game.

I'm not trying to lead any witchhunt. I'm just being objective.

skinsguy · 11-21-2004, 10:34 PM

He has said that...

Sheriff Gonna Getcha · 11-21-2004, 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skinsguy

He has said that...

I was joking.

skinsguy · 11-21-2004, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djnemo65

Gibbs started 0-5 his first year but rapidly improved after that. We started 1-4, and yet seem no better offensively then we were against Tampa Bay.
I'm not trying to lead any witchhunt. I'm just being objective.

Its a fair assessment..we haven't hit a hot streak in this season like that season and may not....however look at the players he had that year...There are no Art Monks or John Riggins on this team.

MTK · 11-21-2004, 10:40 PM

Seems like people's expectations were maybe a bit too high today, especially considering the QB change we were all desperately calling for.

Remember that before this week Ramsey saw very little time with the 1st unit. As a result, the playcalling was scaled back today to keep things easy for him.

Did anyone really think we were going to come out guns blazin with Ramsey?

Yes the playcalling was very conservative, but we've seen what happens when Ramsey takes more chances. I thought the gameplan was set up to keep Ramsey out of bad situations, build up his confidence and let him make a big play or two.

Unfortunately with a conservative, scaled back attack like we saw today, there's a very small margin for error. And when you have numerous penalties and mental mistakes, that's going to really put a dent in that conservative gameplan.

djnemo65 · 11-21-2004, 10:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

ugh how many times do I have to say Gibbs deserves some criticism?

I'd just like to see a more even argument here. Seems like we're piling on Gibbs and overlooking what the players are doing, or not doing to be more specific.

I think we owe Gibbs the same level of scrutiny we gave Spurrier, and we excoriated him for these same things the last two years. Now that its Gibbs it doesn't make sense to suddenly blame the players.

We all agree that the players, at least on paper, are good. so who do you blame when good playes don't perform?

Sheriff Gonna Getcha · 11-21-2004, 10:42 PM

I agree that Gibbs kept it pretty conservative to keep Ramsey's confidence up. That was a good move. I just didn't expect to see him call plays THAT conservative.

11-21-2004, 10:15 PM	#1
skinsguy Pro Bowl Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Greensboro, North Carolina Posts: 6,766	Execution Sucks! Figured I'd try my best to even out the Joe Gibbs witch hunt threads. The reason why we're 3-7 right now is for many reasons and to say it's sloely Joe Gibbs is just completely wrong. We've had injuries...our top players out for most if not all the season; Brunell has been a dissappointment...our receivers have been inconsistant...execution overall has not been consistant. Yes Joe Gibbs play calling hasn't been golden all the time...ya know this is his first season back in 12 years...what do you expect? He's working out the kinks. Its' trial and error for him right now and some of the errors make him look pathetic, while some of the positives make him look like a genius. Its not one thing that has made us 3-7, it's many things, but its things that can be corrected by next season...Gibbs said he's going to find out who are Redskins players and who are not...Maybe he thought all along of this season being a rebuilding season. Maybe it's possible that the play calling right now is merely just an audtion?? Whatever it is, Gibbs isn't the problem.

11-21-2004, 10:21 PM	#2
Sheriff Gonna Getcha Franchise Player Join Date: Feb 2004 Age: 46 Posts: 8,317	#1 Gibbs was the guy who went after Brunell so hard. Doesn't he share in the blame for that? #2 Most of our injuries have affected our defense and our defense is ranked #2 whereas our offense is ranked #31 (in scoring). #3 Jon Jansen was the only starter out on offense until today (when Thomas got hurt). #4 If the players aren't executing, as head coach, doesn't Gibbs get some of the blame for that? #5 Gibbs isn't the sole reason for our record, but he's the head coach. He picked his staff, he chose our roster (i.e. Brunell), and he coaches the players. To absolve him of blame is just wrong.

11-21-2004, 10:23 PM	#3
MTK \m/ Join Date: Feb 2004 Age: 52 Posts: 99,832	LOL so much for that 1 post and we're back on pushing the blame on Gibbs.

11-21-2004, 10:25 PM	#4
Gmanc711 Thank You, Sean. Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Gaithersburg, MD Age: 39 Posts: 7,506	To absolve blame Gibbs of blame is wrong, I agree. To place the blame soley on him is wong as well. Theres gotta be some middle ground here. Maybe were not as patient as we are telling others (media) to be. Gibbs is obviously struggling finding a offense. I think he just has to relize that in todays NFL, we cant just play everything safe. We have to gamble, which will pay off and hurt us at the same time. In some situations, it will be the difference for a win, in others a loss. We cant play like we did today ( playcalling) and expect to win. All of the blame isnt on him, and people would be crazy to say it is, but some of it absolutley falls on him. __________________ #21

11-21-2004, 10:30 PM	#6
skinsguy Pro Bowl Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Greensboro, North Carolina Posts: 6,766	Gibbs picks his players yet there is only one name mentioned..nobody has mentioned Portis, Sean Taylor, Griffin, Springs....new players that have been positive for us. Ramsey sucked in the preseason and Brunell played better...it came down to Brunell not doing his job in the regular season...that falls on Brunell....again EXECUTION. If the players aren't executing, how can you blame the coach? Why is it Gibbs' fault that Ramsey over throws a wide open Coles down the field? Certainly Gibbs isn't the sole reason and yeah he's made some mistakes and some bad play calling and he'll tell you that himself. Yet, it gets rather unbelieveable when we blame the coaches on execution...they are not the ones playing on the field.

11-21-2004, 10:34 PM	#9
djnemo65 Playmaker Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,836	I completely agree with your assessment ramseyfan. I would also add that its not just that the play calling has been at times spotty, but it was today completely inexplicable. i think it was ambrose bierce who said that the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results, and that's my attitude towards Gibbs' stubborn playcalling. Playaction passes on first down were sitting there for us to take, especially early, and we kept just plugging Portis up the middle, as if he's Jerome Bettis. And what hurts me most is the lack of improvement on offense. I thought ramsey did well and made alot of throws that brunell certainly would not have, but there is a larger problem in gameplanning that persists. Also, someone needs to tell Gibbs that third and three is not a running down in today's NFL. How many times this year have we been stuffed in that situation. Gibbs started 0-5 his first year but rapidly improved after that. We started 1-4, and yet seem no better offensively then we were against Tampa Bay. For me the sparkle of those three past Lombardi trophies has faded, and my attitude is now show me. show me you can move the ball. show me you can adjust your gameplan to what the defense gives you. show me you understand the nuances of todays game. I'm not trying to lead any witchhunt. I'm just being objective.

11-21-2004, 10:40 PM	#13
MTK \m/ Join Date: Feb 2004 Age: 52 Posts: 99,832	Seems like people's expectations were maybe a bit too high today, especially considering the QB change we were all desperately calling for. Remember that before this week Ramsey saw very little time with the 1st unit. As a result, the playcalling was scaled back today to keep things easy for him. Did anyone really think we were going to come out guns blazin with Ramsey? Yes the playcalling was very conservative, but we've seen what happens when Ramsey takes more chances. I thought the gameplan was set up to keep Ramsey out of bad situations, build up his confidence and let him make a big play or two. Unfortunately with a conservative, scaled back attack like we saw today, there's a very small margin for error. And when you have numerous penalties and mental mistakes, that's going to really put a dent in that conservative gameplan.

11-21-2004, 10:42 PM	#15
Sheriff Gonna Getcha Franchise Player Join Date: Feb 2004 Age: 46 Posts: 8,317	I agree that Gibbs kept it pretty conservative to keep Ramsey's confidence up. That was a good move. I just didn't expect to see him call plays THAT conservative.

Execution Sucks!

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