Is Russell really better than Quinn?

[djnemo65]

Originally Posted by dmek25

if he was that big a stud, why no heisman invite? he made his name with the win over Notre dame, and his arm strength. to me, he is just another akili smith

I'm not sure that's the best standard for evaluating a quarterback. Only 3 guys got invites this year. Just because a couple media guys with morning shows who know nothing about college ball waited till after that game to start talking about him doesn't mean his name hasn't been out there for over 2 years.

He had 8 fourth quarter comebacks in college playing as an underclassman. He has always showed poise and maturity. I love how people who have barely watched him play make bold proclamations about his future in the NFL.

I think if LSU had a deal with NBC this debate would be a lot more one sided.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by djnemo65

I think if LSU had a deal with NBC this debate would be a lot more one sided.

I do too.

[djnemo65]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

But even in this offseason, no one knew if Russell was even going to be LSU's starter. I mean, talk about someone who wasn't on the NFL 1st round radar, his own team was evaluating other options.

That wasn't an indictment of Russell, but rather a testament to the amazing depth LSU had at that position, including a guy who won mvp in the Peach Bowl the year before after Russell got hurt, and the number one player coming out of high school. The fact that Russell was still able to easily secure the position is if anything a further credit to his ability.

There's no question that Quinn is the more NFL ready of the two, but by your own argument Gtripp rookies are developmental projects who shouldn't be expected to contribute immediately.

[Defensewins]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Ok, but what is upside? Russell either will be really good, or he won't. There is no mythical concept of potential of which he will only hit under certain circumstances. Upside just simply refers to the growth that each prospect will make over the course of his NFL career. Every player grows. Is there any reason at all to expect Russell to grow at a different rate than any other QB? I don't understand why this would occur.

The reason is because Jamarcus, like Vince Young, has never played in a pro style offense. Quinn and Leinart have played in a pro style offense for years and there is plenty of tape to see them in it and they know what to expect. Jemarcus will either sink or swim with a more complicated pro system.

Interesting Note:
I just spoke to my buddy that is an LSU alum and attends multiple games a year. He bleeds LSU football. I trust his football opinion and he knows the LSU players very well.

He says safety L. Landry is a can't miss, one of a kind player. That he is special and what sets him apart is he is a smart football player. He understands his role and is rarely out of position. He has a good head on his sholuders and is very mature for his age. He is a good person.
Jamarcus on the other hand he was not sold on him making it. He says, yes he has a rocket for an arm, is a decent athlete, is big yet fairly agile ofr his size. But he questions his smarts and his football smarts.
My friend is a huge gambler, he will gamble on anything. He told he would not bet on Jemarcus making it in the NFL. That he is not a sure thing.
He will either hit it out of the park or miss completely.
I was surprised that this die-hard LSU fan would say anything remotely bad about his LSU players so this is eye opening for me.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Defensewins

He says safety L. Landry is a can't miss, one of a kind player. That he is special and what sets him apart is he is a smart football player. He understands his role and is rarely out of position. He has a good head on his sholuders and is very mature for his age. He is a good person.
Jamarcus on the other hand he was not sold on him making it. He says, yes he has a rocket for an arm, is a decent athlete, is big yet fairly agile ofr his size. But he questions his smarts and his football smarts.
My friend is a huge gambler, he will gamble on anything. He told he would not bet on Jemarcus making it in the NFL. That he is not a sure thing.
He will either hit it out of the park or miss completely.
I was surprised that this die-hard LSU fan would say anything remotely bad about his LSU players so this is eye opening for me.

I would agree with your friend on both accounts although I carry neither the vast experience with LSU that he does nor any potential biases from such fanship.

Landry seems like a can't miss at safety...presuming you need a safety. Russell would have benefited from another year at LSU.

[djnemo65]

Anyway, my final thought is this: I have no idea how Russell will turn out as a pro but I understand the decision calculus and grading criteria that would have him chosen ahead of Quinn. For the record, I'm rooting for both guys.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by djnemo65

There's no question that Quinn is the more NFL ready of the two, but by your own argument Gtripp rookies are developmental projects who shouldn't be expected to contribute immediately.

Exactly.

I just think that it's absured to expect that this experence edge that Quinn takes with him to the NFL to EVER be nullified, barring of course an injury to Quinn. JaMarcus is going to have to come in green as grass and not only learn the nuiances of the NFL but the developmental stuff he could have learned in college at the same time. The game is going to be really fast for him.

The game will be fast for Quinn as a rookie also, theres no denying that. But once Quinn gets a year of experience behind him, he should be ready to make the jump to a top half passer. Russell won't ever make this jump because he didn't learn everything he could have in college.

Any experience that Russell gets at the NFL level in practice is time that Quinn will also be improving his game. As long as they are both on the practice field every week, this large gap in experience isn't going away, ever.

There's stuff you learn in college that helps you in the NFL, and stuff you learn in the NFL to help you in the NFL. Russell cuts his college career short and he loses access to all that valueable experience.

He's never going to understand the game like Quinn does, and thats because Quinn got more exposure to the college game than Russell did.

[djnemo65]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Exactly.

I just think that it's absured to expect that this experence edge that Quinn takes with him to the NFL to EVER be nullified, barring of course an injury to Quinn. JaMarcus is going to have to come in green as grass and not only learn the nuiances of the NFL but the developmental stuff he could have learned in college at the same time. The game is going to be really fast for him.

The game will be fast for Quinn as a rookie also, theres no denying that. But once Quinn gets a year of experience behind him, he should be ready to make the jump to a top half passer. Russell won't ever make this jump because he didn't learn everything he could have in college.

Any experience that Russell gets at the NFL level in practice is time that Quinn will also be improving his game. As long as they are both on the practice field every week, this large gap in experience isn't going away, ever.

There's stuff you learn in college that helps you in the NFL, and stuff you learn in the NFL to help you in the NFL. Russell cuts his college career short and he loses access to all that valueable experience.

He's never going to understand the game like Quinn does, and thats because Quinn got more exposure to the college game than Russell did.

That's a fair point and you might be right. The other thing I worry about is Russell getting thrown into a terrible situation like Oakland and being expected to contribute immediately. These days the timeframe placed upon young quarterbacks is absurd. In many ways Quinn dropping might be the best thing for his career

[SmootSmack]

Quinn could be another Carr or Harrington. Considerable experience in college, under a pro system. But basically plateaued. Which may not be a bad thing, if he's in the right situation.

[budw38]

Lets face it , scouts do not have to be reasonable to find work . I would bet the ranch , if ND had played OSU for the championship , and Quinn and Smith had big time stats , they would be going 1-2 . It happens every year , a player has a big bowl game and overnight he is the next great hall of famer .I imagine that the QB taken by the best team will be the " better " qb .

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Quinn could be another Carr or Harrington. Considerable experience in college, under a pro system. But basically plateaued. Which may not be a bad thing, if he's in the right situation.

Brady Quinn: 46 starts

Joey Harrington: 28 starts
David Carr: 25 starts

Maybe not the best comparision.

[SmootSmack]

Fair enough. So what sort of career do you expect from Charlie "44 starts" Frye?

[KLHJ2]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Fair enough. So what sort of career do you expect from Charlie "44 starts" Frye?

GET EM! How long did it take you to find that little tid bit?

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by angryssg

GET EM! How long did it take you to find that little tid bit?

One phone call

[KLHJ2]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

One phone call

Tell Mel that I said whats up.