Civil Discussion About Religion

LOL this is getting good

No. It actually makes no mathematical sense. The more you play, the more you lose. It's a basic law of averages.

Do me a favor, and just try my basic thoughts (that I posted in a previous post) on that website. Let me know how much you win.
If you lost, you either didn't follow what I said, or didn't understand my instructions.

Here is some more "proof." Scientific Evidence against Evolution (concise and short) (http://www.changinglivesonline.org/evolution.html)
If it's all so wrong, why don't you disprove it, instead of taking two sentences and saying that this doesn't disprove evolution. What you said didn't prove anything about evolution either.

OK I'll humor you. Your Christian website has a very limited understanding of the law of thermodynamics. The law states that matter becomes more disorderly over time - ie decays. But evolution states that the order of organic matter is actually becoming more organized, therefore it violates the law of thermodynamics. That's laughable.

When a person dies, their bodies do indeed decay. But evolution is the result of changes in the OFFSPRING of the dead person. I ask you, how does a human being grow? It takes the matter (organic molecules from food, like protien) synthesizes them, and adds the molecules to the body. That body grows to full size, and later dies. Then the decay happens. But while some people are dying and decaying, others are being born and growing. As our great grandparents lay dead in their caskets and decaying, our children are growing up, and creating new babies. Every time you create a new baby, you're not actually taking matter away from the parents, you know that right? The new child builds it's body up on FOOD, not decaying matter.

And you want to call this science? They don't even understand the disconnect between the law of thermodynamics and new life growing through the introduction of fresh food to the body.

OK I'll humor you. Your Christian website has a very limited understanding of the law of thermodynamics. The law states that matter becomes more disorderly over time - ie decays. But evolution states that the order of organic matter is actually becoming more organized, therefore it violates the law of thermodynamics. That's laughable.

You want humor? Here's some humor (http://youtube.com/watch?v=oWorVoeZd3A) (wait for it)

You actually have a good mind for what my system says. But don't bet the actual numbers. Bet the black and reds, and bet the 1st / 2nd / 3rd 12's, and the even / odds. A simple way is this...put $5 on 2nd 12, and $5 on 3rd 12. Then put $5 on red, and $5 on odd. (total of $20 on table) So let's say it hits on black 13. You won with 2nd 12, so that's $10 winning there, you also won with $5 odd, so that's $5 there, so you won $15, and get $10 back from your wager (the $5 on 2nd twelve and the $5 on odd) You lost $10 total (from 3rd 12, and black). So you now have $25 in your pocket, which means you are up $5 total. Now since you already won 2nd 12 and odd, don't play those again, but double the money in the area you did lose in. So bet $10 red this time. If You lose again, bet $20 and so on, so let's say you hit on that $20 bet. Now you win $20, but only lost $10...$15 if you count the first $5, but I already counted that in my previous numbers, so you just won $10 more. So now your first session is over and you have won / taken away from the table, $15. Repeat the process when you notice patterns. ie: Red has hit 3 times in a row, or 1st 12 hit 2 times in a row. Etc.

A non beleiver will always be a non beleiver unless they try.
So try Free Roulette: Learn to play roulette today for free (http://www.freeroulette.com) and give my basic system a try. I have a complex system that I use, but that would take a really long time to explain.
I usually only do the system once or twice, occasionally 3 times depending on the patterns, then I walk away from the table with anywhere from $15-$75. Do this 10 times, and even at the smallest amount, you are up $150. I will generally play 30 times throughout my cruises (for instance) and the first time I went on a cruise I won over 1k. But I rarely win less than $500 when I do play. That is kinda my bench mark of success.
The second you get greedy, you lose. The second you stray from the process, you lose. If you think small, and think strategically, you'll win. Never let the other players around you intimidate you to play more, just stick to the process. The reason people lose at a lot of these games is because they get greedy. The best times to play are after 00 or 0 hit, cause the chance they hit again are slimmer. But after about 10-13 times of green not hitting, put $1 on both, when they do hit, and they will, you come out on top even more, if they don't while using my system, no biggy, you lost only a few dollars but you are still up a lot.

Jsarno, I'd love to discuss gambling more, because I do love it. But given that it's off topic, this is going to be my last post on the subject.

The math is simple. Every spot on the board pays you off as if there are 36 possible numbers to bet. If you bet red or black, they pay you 1 to 1 (36/18). If you bet 1st 12, they pay you 3 to 1 (36/12). If you play a 4-corner bet, they pay you 9 to 1 (36/4). But there are 38 spots on the board. That means, on average, you're going to make your money back on 36 of the 38 spots. On the 37th and 38th spots, you will lose. That's why the house advantage in roullette is 5.2% (on a table with 0 and 00). It's 2.7% on a table with just 0. You can look those numbers up.

That means over time, if you play enough, you will lose either 5.2% or 2.7% of the money you bet.

I can tell that if all you're doing is playing on cruises and the occasional trip to the casino, your system hasn't gotten a good enough workout. I encourage you to play 1000 spins, betting the same amount of money each time, using any system you wish. You'll see the results.

That's it on the subject.

No you're misunderstanding me. I understood his point, he said just because you can't see the wind doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Likewise, you can't see God, but that doesn't mean he doesn't exist. I got the point. Now here's mine: I only believe that things exist if there is scientific evidence that it exists. I don't have to see the evidence with my eyes, but there has to be evidence. Wind: you don't see it, but you feel it on your skin, and you can measure its velocity. Chemical scanners can analyze it and tell you that it's made up of oxygen, hydrogen, nitrogen, and other gases. Other stars in space: detected by Hubble.

I don't believe God exists because there's no evidence of it. People who believe in him go on faith. In the bolded part above, you're simply asking the fundamental question. Do you or don't you believe God exists? I don't. I need evidence. There is NONE. There is only faith. That's not enough for me. If it is for you, that's fine. But please, don't try to tell me that because I can't see the wind, and because I can't see God, therefore he exists. That's the most retarded logic in the world.

FYI- thanks for toning down the posts...I feel you offer a good counterpoint to the arguments, so I would not like to see your posts ignored.
I agree that just because you can't see the wind, that is an arguement for the existance of God. I am glad to see you got the point as well.
I do firmly beleive that to prove the existance of God, you need look no farther than the mirror. A human being can not scientifically be proven. There are so many loop holes in how we started to where we are now from a scientific standpoint. How do we all of a sudden "adapt" to our surroundings, then grow stuff to accomodate? The human body is so complex that is could not have been by accident. I realize this is opinion, but so is evolution. (keep in mind I fully beleive in evolution). Evolution is not fact, it is theory...or opinion. After I am done looking at myself in the mirror to my beliefs that God exists, I look around the world at how everything fits just right. How can there be no other planet in all our explored galaxies that can sustain our life? How is it from the billions and billions or stars / planets, this is the ONLY one we can live on? The only one that has such a delecate system that we can actually wipe ourselves off the planet? It's just right, not too hot, not too cold, plenty of oxygen, plenty of sun light...perfect rotation, perfect revolution etc. It's just too much of a coincidence not to be from a higher design. The odds of all this being like this by coincidence is so astronomical I don't have enough space to place the odds. How can science honestly overcome those odds?

I seem close minded to you because I'm unwilling to go on faith alone regarding the existence of God. I was engaging the morons in this thread who tried to present "scientific" evidence that the theory of evolution has been disproven. I won't apologize for coming harsh at someone who does that. Everyone knows that there is no scientific evidence disproving the theory of evolution. If there was, it would never be taught in our public schools again. Giving me a link to some guy's musings and passing it off as scientific proof is nothing short of retarded, and quite frankly, insulting to my intelligence.

I have no problem with your views at all. I think if you believe in it, that's great. There really is no harm in being religious at all (as long as you don't organize against other faiths or discriminate against other faiths, and I don't think you do). What I have a problem with is trying to pass off a heaping pile of crap as actual evidence. I mean we all went to high school right? We all know that evidence needs to come from credible sources, right? We know that if we write a term paper and say something like E=MC2 (my friend James told me so). No, we have to put E=MC2 (Einstein).

Just like in Redskin related threads we ask for links to news stories, I'm doing the same thing here. You can't come on the board making claims that aren't true and then go linking to some hack. Again, the problem wasn't with his or your belief. The problem was with the style of debate.

Religion is all about faith. For anyone to think they can prove the existence of God, then they don't even understand religion at all. His existence cannot be proven. You can only believe in him based on faith. That's the entire point of religion: believe in Him and ye shall be saved.


Again, I appreciate your points, and your approach.
I will say this, It is by faith I believe in God, just as it is by faith I beleive in evolution. Science said that world was flat, they were wrong. It is faith in the human mind that makes me beleive in evolution. But I also say again, evolution is not the answer to who, but the answer to how.

Jsarno, I'd love to discuss gambling more, because I do love it. But given that it's off topic, this is going to be my last post on the subject.

The math is simple. Every spot on the board pays you off as if there are 36 possible numbers to bet. If you bet red or black, they pay you 1 to 1 (36/18). If you bet 1st 12, they pay you 3 to 1 (36/12). If you play a 4-corner bet, they pay you 9 to 1 (36/4). But there are 38 spots on the board. That means, on average, you're going to make your money back on 36 of the 38 spots. On the 37th and 38th spots, you will lose. That's why the house advantage in roullette is 5.2% (on a table with 0 and 00). It's 2.7% on a table with just 0. You can look those numbers up.

That means over time, if you play enough, you will lose either 5.2% or 2.7% of the money you bet.

I can tell that if all you're doing is playing on cruises and the occasional trip to the casino, your system hasn't gotten a good enough workout. I encourage you to play 1000 spins, betting the same amount of money each time, using any system you wish. You'll see the results.

That's it on the subject.

I agree with you, it is off subject, and we should no longer comment on it. I ask again, just try what I posted. I know the numbers you provide. I have a masters in finance...I KNOW numbers. I beleive I found a small loop hole in the system.
ps- I have played more roulette than everyone on this site combined (more than likely). I'm not trying to tell you to kill someone...I'm telling you just to try my basic system on a free website. That's all. You canPM me with how much you "won". It's free, what's the harm?

OK I'll humor you. Your Christian website has a very limited understanding of the law of thermodynamics. The law states that matter becomes more disorderly over time - ie decays. But evolution states that the order of organic matter is actually becoming more organized, therefore it violates the law of thermodynamics. That's laughable.

When a person dies, their bodies do indeed decay. But evolution is the result of changes in the OFFSPRING of the dead person. I ask you, how does a human being grow? It takes the matter (organic molecules from food, like protien) synthesizes them, and adds the molecules to the body. That body grows to full size, and later dies. Then the decay happens. But while some people are dying and decaying, others are being born and growing. As our great grandparents lay dead in their caskets and decaying, our children are growing up, and creating new babies. Every time you create a new baby, you're not actually taking matter away from the parents, you know that right? The new child builds it's body up on FOOD, not decaying matter.

And you want to call this science? They don't even understand the disconnect between the law of thermodynamics and new life growing through the introduction of fresh food to the body.
It didn't say that people can't have offspring and grow up. It said that overall in the entire universe, things are moving to disorder and that evolution goes against this. You also still haven't proved anything for evolution.

It's off to work guys...I'll see you tomorrow.