All things Middle East related

[nonniey]

Originally Posted by punch it in

Ill keep repeating myself Trump would have walked away and possibly had a ceremony in the rose garden to celebrate amid the ensuing chaos. Fox would have been playing hail to the chief as they floated a possible nobel peace prize. At least Biden is not ignoring the situation. Trump would have flown 1000 Americans out and said it was all fake news and a witch hunt.
See the insurrection. See the kurds. See rocket man. See hate crimes that were at a boiling point because of his mouth. I agree it was a fuck up none the less. Trump would have done the same as you have said many times and would not have tried to make it right.
Biden should be expressing major remorse about his decision at this point besides what he is doing behind the scenes to try and make it right though. Im thoroughly disappointed in the way he is still talking about the mess.

Re: Trump you are peaching to the choir. I have no doubt Trump would have been even worse given his history. But right now there are 10-15k (maybe more) Americans trapped in Taliban controlled territory, some of them, maybe even many of them, aren't going to make it out. Biden turned a stable situation into a catastrophe.

[punch it in]

Originally Posted by nonniey

Re: Trump you are peaching to the choir. I have no doubt Trump would have been even worse given his history. But right now there are 10-15k (maybe more) Americans trapped in Taliban controlled territory, some of them, maybe even many of them, aren't going to make it out. Biden turned a stable situation into a catastrophe.

Agreed. And I know i was preaching to the choir. There are many afghan allies, all their families, and other foreign allies also trapped. The longer the cameras and media stay there the better. If the Taliban knows the World is watching they will behave to an extent.
I do find myself wondering how it would have been possible to get all those mentioned out whether we had 2500 troops there or not. Stable situation before? Yes. Everyone singing kumbaya not exactly. So I hesitate to say that there was some yellow brick road before for everyone- especially the Afghanistans that helped us and their families. You are talking mass exodus. Biden could have done an expert job and there would be problems. But he certainly could have cut the losses. Im praying for everyone- EVERYONE- in danger to get out and I hope to God Biden does everything in his power to clean up the mess that he was largely in charge of.

[nonniey]

Originally Posted by punch it in

Agreed. And I know i was preaching to the choir. There are many afghan allies, all their families, and other foreign allies also trapped. The longer the cameras and media stay there the better. If the Taliban knows the World is watching they will behave to an extent.
I do find myself wondering how it would have been possible to get all those mentioned out whether we had 2500 troops there or not. Stable situation before? Yes. Everyone singing kumbaya not exactly. So I hesitate to say that there was some yellow brick road before for everyone- especially the Afghanistans that helped us and their families. You are talking mass exodus. Biden could have done an expert job and there would be problems. But he certainly could have cut the losses. Im praying for everyone- EVERYONE- in danger to get out and I hope to God Biden does everything in his power to clean up the mess that he was largely in charge of.

Well the point was we wouldn't have had to get them out if we stuck with what we were doing. Again 8-10 casualties a year and an occasional non military American casualty before last year then none for over a year. Now potentially thousands of American casualties (Oh and odds are some have already been killed). This idiocy is mind boggling. Seems we replaced one of the worst Presidents in US history with one of the worst Presidents in US history.

[punch it in]

Originally Posted by nonniey

Well the point was we wouldn't have had to get them out if we stuck with what we were doing. Again 8-10 casualties a year and an occasional non military American casualty before last year then none for over a year. Now potentially thousands of American casualties (Oh and odds are some have already been killed). This idiocy is mind boggling. Seems we replaced one of the worst Presidents in US history with one of the worst Presidents in US history.

So why is everyone in favor of leaving? Forget the hack job exit for a moment, clearly the last few presidents, and most Americans wanted out.
Not in disagreement with you, seriously asking.

[nonniey]

Originally Posted by punch it in

So why is everyone in favor of leaving? Forget the hack job exit for a moment, clearly the last few presidents, and most Americans wanted out.
Not in disagreement with you, seriously asking.

Bad policy can be popular. Popularity of a position doesn't = it being the right or correct position. A good President (when he is able) will make the right decision not the popular decision or decision that he thinks will score him the most political points.
Examples
- Prohibition
- Opposition to Lend Lease 1940-41 (President made right decision - went against popular choice).
- Detention of Japanese Americans
- The War on Poverty - (The Economic Opportunity Act 1964).
- 1980s Opposition to Nuclear Missile fielding in Europe (President made right decision - went against popular choice).
- Regime change in Iraq
- Full Iraq withdrawal 2011
- And now Afghan withdrawal.

[punch it in]

Originally Posted by nonniey

Bad policy can be popular. Popularity of a position doesn't = it being the right or correct position. A good President (when he is able) will make the right decision not the popular decision or decision that he thinks will score him the most political points.
Examples
- Prohibition
- Opposition to Lend Lease 1940-41 (President made right decision - went against popular choice).
- Detention of Japanese Americans
- The War on Poverty - (The Economic Opportunity Act 1964).
- 1980s Opposition to Nuclear Missile fielding in Europe (President made right decision - went against popular choice).
- Regime change in Iraq
- Full Iraq withdrawal 2011
- And now Afghan withdrawal.

I hear you but this was overwhelmingly popular with not only politicians but citizens…but I hear you