Mancow Waterboarded, Admits It's Torture

[firstdown]

Dang I just gained a little respect for Gore:

Gore laughed and said, 'That's a no-brainer. Of course it's a violation of international law, that's why it's a covert action. The guy is a terrorist. Go grab his ass.'" [20]

[Daseal]

Slingin' Sammy, you've quoted it and said "if, if, if" but never answered the question. Are you okay with American's being tortured?

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by Daseal

Slingin' Sammy, you've quoted it and said "if, if, if" but never answered the question. Are you okay with American's being tortured?

I will answer this way, in a perfect world no one would torture, and/or be tortured. However, lets not play dumb a** and say Americans are NOT tortured. We have witnessed our soldiers dragged and beaten, civilians heads chopped off on the internet, planes flown directly into a civilian target. If I thought for half a second that us not torturing these agents would prevent these types of acts from re-occurring, then do not use these techniques. BUT our enemies will torture regardless of our actions, they will commit atrocities against civilians regardless of our civility, they will seek out targets that will cause mass casualties regardless of our attempts to use pinpoint accuracy and minimize civilian casualties.
Bottomline, no I do not want United States citizens tortured, but I recognize our enemies regardless of my desires, and so if we need to use brutal tactics on the very worst of the worst, then so be it

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by Daseal

Slingin' Sammy, you've quoted it and said "if, if, if" but never answered the question. Are you okay with American's being tortured?

Our special forces are Americans. Our special forces go through waterboarding. Yes, I am OK with that. They have to be prepared for what they will face from our enemies if captured. It sucks that there are bad people in the world, but that's how it is.

I'm not quite sure what corner you're trying to paint me into here. Of course I'm not OK with Americans being tortured.

If there are Americans who decide to become terrorists and go out an kill innocent people in say, India, Poland, England, etc. and they get caught and their government feels that they need to waterboard them to get information to save the lives of their own citizens then I'm OK with that country doing what it needs to do to protect itself.

American soldiers are covered by the Geneva Convention, so if captured then they shouldn't be tortured under any circumstance. If we were at war with Russia or China and we caught some of their uniformed soldiers on the battlefield I would NOT be OK with torturing them.

Did I miss a specific scenario?

[Missin21]

Originally Posted by GhettoDogAllStars

Violence perpetuates violence.

Sometimes violence ENDS violence. If someone is standing there hitting you KNOWING you won't hit back, diplomacy won't end it. But if you suddenly stand up & punch the guy in the face a few times, he'll stop.

Diplomacy can go only so far. With some people & certain TYPES of people, violence is the only thing that works.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

What are you trying to say?

EDIT: just saw the bolded part, I get it. Question for you, if you could've waterboarded one of the 4 soldiers before the rape and murder of the Iraqi family and gained the intel to stop the murders, would you waterboard to get the info?

My opinion: If the facts stated are true & correct, that this ex-soldier and the other soldiers raped and murdered this girl and her family, they deserve the death penalty.

No I wouldn't resort to torture because I wouldn't assume torture was the only viable means of archiving the desired result. Furthermore, your argument for torture in this instance would pave the way for using torture in any scenario where someone's life is in danger.

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by Daseal

Slingin' Sammy, you've quoted it and said "if, if, if" but never answered the question. Are you okay with American's being tortured?

If there were Americans forming groups and running planes into another countries buildings like what happened here then at that point they are on their own. See I just don't see this as a coventional type war with another country so my views are different.

[Missin21]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

Did I miss a specific scenario?

Personally, I have seen youtube videos of Americans being tortured AND murdered (I can recall one specific journalist[?] I believe where we watched these animals saw his head off with a machete). I think we should be just as willing to go as far as them to stop the terrorism as they are to create it.

It seems to me that the more we try to "abide" by rules that only exist to make THEIR lives easier for committing these crimes, the more we play into their hands.

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by Missin21

Personally, I have seen youtube videos of Americans being tortured AND murdered (I can recall one specific journalist[?] I believe where we watched these animals saw his head off with a machete). I think we should be just as willing to go as far as them to stop the terrorism as they are to create it.

It seems to me that the more we try to "abide" by rules that only exist to make THEIR lives easier for committing these crimes, the more we play into their hands.

I'm not willing to go that far.

[firstdown]

Top Al-Qaida suspect Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, who has been held at Guantanamo Bay since 2003, said he beheaded American journalist Daniel Pearl in Pakistan in 2002, according to the transcript of a hearing at the Guantanamo prison camp released Thursday.

"I decapitated with my blessed right hand the head of the American Jew Daniel Pearl," Mohammed said through a personal representative, according to the transcript released by the Pentagon.

[Missin21]

Originally Posted by firstdown

I'm not willing to go that far.

I am. And then some.

I say go after their families. They are born to die for their cause & take as many Americans & Jews with them as possible, but they know in doing so, their families will be protected & provided for by their governments. You take that protection away, you take away that motivation.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by Missin21

I am. And then some.

I say go after their families. They are born to die for their cause & take as many Americans & Jews with them as possible, but they know in doing so, their families will be protected & provided for by their governments. You take that protection away, you take away that motivation.

That's some evil genius shit right there...good stuff man...keep the ideas flowing.

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by saden1

No I wouldn't resort to torture because I wouldn't assume torture was the only viable means of archiving the desired result. Furthermore, your argument for torture in this instance would pave the way for using torture in any scenario where someone's life is in danger.

I agree.

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by saden1

No I wouldn't resort to torture because I wouldn't assume torture was the only viable means of archiving the desired result. Furthermore, your argument for torture in this instance would pave the way for using torture in any scenario where someone's life is in danger.

If Obama released the means of torture then why if it didn't work did he not release the results from what YOU call torture?

[Trample the Elderly]

Originally Posted by dmek25

what if it was an American being water boarded? would that be OK?

I would prefer it. When I take them apart with a chainsaw I could understand their screams for mercy. :FIREdevil