Here's our chance for Jeff Fisher

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by SFREDSKIN

Fisher no SB win
Shanahan 2 SB w/ Elway
Gruden 1 SB 1st year in TB (Dungy built that team)
Shottenheimer couldn't even win (ok, maybe ine) a playoff game

And you could say that Bill Callahan took Gruden's Raiders' to the Superbowl when they played against Tampa Bay. And that Dungy has won a SB with one of the best QB in the NFL (Manning).

No offense, but I think you're stretching your argument here. It's ok for you to say that you wouldn't want these guys to coach the Redskins, but I think you're making a poor argument about these guys being average coaches.

[SFREDSKIN]

Originally Posted by Ruhskins

And you could say that Bill Callahan took Gruden's Raiders' to the Superbowl when they played against Tampa Bay. And that Dungy has won a SB with one of the best QB in the NFL (Manning).

No offense, but I think you're stretching your argument here. It's ok for you to say that you wouldn't want these guys to coach the Redskins, but I think you're making a poor argument about these guys being average coaches.

It's like in sports, what have you done for me lately mentality. Most fans in this forum have no patience and want things turned around overnite and think this guys are saviors. I rather take my chance with a young/hungry proven coordinator (not QB coach) than this retreads who have had their chances.

[JoeRedskin]

Originally Posted by SFREDSKIN

It's like in sports, what have you done for me lately mentality. Most fans in this forum have no patience and want things turned around overnite and think this guys are saviors. I rather take my chance with a young/hungry proven coordinator (not QB coach) than this retreads who have had their chances.

Remember, Belicheck was also a retread. Dungy didn't win a SB with "the team he built" in TBay. He had to be a "retread" in Indy to get it. Retread J. Gruden won his SB against the team he built in Oakland. Retread T. Coughlin won a SB after being run out on a rail from Jacksonville. Retread D. Vermeil got a SB with the Rams and got damn close with KCity.

None of these coaches were successful in their first stints. You're right - patience is required but there may be something to be said for hiring a coach who knows how to manage a game and build a team. Even if he doesn't bring championships, maybe as Dungy did in TBay, they can set the stage for further success.

BUT - for the record - I am with the "First GM, then HC" crowd. I just think a new GM should not discount those with HC exp. just b/c they didn't win a gazillion SB's in their first stint.

[Hog1]

Originally Posted by joeredskin

remember, belicheck was also a retread. Dungy didn't win a sb with "the team he built" in tbay. He had to be a "retread" in indy to get it. Retread j. Gruden won his sb against the team he built in oakland. Retread t. Coughlin won a sb after being run out on a rail from jacksonville. Retread d. Vermeil got a sb with the rams and got damn close with kcity.

None of these coaches were successful in their first stints. You're right - patience is required but there may be something to be said for hiring a coach who knows how to manage a game and build a team. Even if he doesn't bring championships, maybe as dungy did in tbay, they can set the stage for further success.

but - for the record - i am with the "first gm, then hc" crowd. I just think a new gm should not discount those with hc exp. Just b/c they didn't win a gazillion sb's in their first stint.

me toooo!

[Paintrain]

Originally Posted by SFREDSKIN

It's like in sports, what have you done for me lately mentality. Most fans in this forum have no patience and want things turned around overnite and think this guys are saviors. I rather take my chance with a young/hungry proven coordinator (not QB coach) than this retreads who have had their chances.

Well in response to you and Smootsmack, it's not so much that we want the 'name' but we want their system, their structure, their professionalism. Does anyone think for a minute that outside of maybe Holmgren or Floyd Reese that if Snyder hires a 'young/hungry' GM and or coach that he's not going to try to bully and big time him as soon as he feels the itch?

I'd like to think that Snyder's matured since the Schottenheimer ordeal to realize that when you've got a guy with a system, a structure and a plan, especially someone with a proven track record, you let him do what he does. I don't think he's matured to that point with just anyone though.

I think the whole 'what has Shanahan done without Elway' or 'he won with Dungy's team' argument is bunk. Each team is a different situation. Shanahan has had a winning program with clowns like Jake Plummer and Brian Griese. Gruden turned over about 35-40% of the roster in his first season and won the Super Bowl. Who is to say what happens if one of them takes over in DC? Maybe they draft the next Matt Ryan, find a Steve Slaton in the 4th or 5th round, sign 3 OL and the light comes on for one of the young WR. What's it going to be then? He is just winning because of the defense that Vinny Ceratto built?