How will chris samuels's retirement affect our cap?

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

And to answer your question, if he retires, no he is not entitled to any funds beyond what he is being paid in FY 2009.

I didn't know that. I assumed that if Samuels retired, he would be entitled to the rest of the pay on his contract. Do you happen to know what the "logic" is behind this situation. If a team releases a player, the team is screwed, but the player is not - he still gets his money. Logically, I would think that if a player "releases" his team by retiring, then the player should be screwed, but the team should not be. If a player retires, why should the player AND the team be penalized for money that is not paid? It doesnt seem like this rule is in the benefit of the players union or the league.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

I didn't know that. I assumed that if Samuels retired, he would be entitled to the rest of the pay on his contract. Do you happen to know what the "logic" is behind this situation. If a team releases a player, the team is screwed, but the player is not - he still gets his money. Logically, I would think that if a player "releases" his team by retiring, then the player should be screwed, but the team should not be. If a player retires, why should the player AND the team be penalized for money that is not paid? It doesnt seem like this rule is in the benefit of the players union or the league.

Because the team's not taking the big cap hit for money not yet paid, the team is taking the cap hit for money already paid but not yet realized on the cap.

A player who gets a $20 million signing bonus up front in a 5 year contract has that bonus prorated per year of his contract. So the $20 million bonus counts $4 million per season. If he's due a base salary of $1 million as well, then his total cap number is $5 million.

But if a player plays one year of that contract and then retires, the team has to realize the other $16 million of the bonus money not yet counted on the cap. This outweighs the savings they realize on not having to pay his base salary.

You can see that the earlier in a contract a player is released, the bigger the cap hit.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

Because the team's not taking the big cap hit for money not yet paid, the team is taking the cap hit for money already paid but not yet realized on the cap.

A player who gets a $20 million signing bonus up front in a 5 year contract has that bonus prorated per year of his contract. So the $20 million bonus counts $4 million per season. If he's due a base salary of $1 million as well, then his total cap number is $5 million.

But if a player plays one year of that contract and then retires, the team has to realize the other $16 million of the bonus money not yet counted on the cap. This outweighs the savings they realize on not having to pay his base salary.

You can see that the earlier in a contract a player is released, the bigger the cap hit.

Gotcha. thanks for the explaination.

Originally Posted by Schneed10

It's unlikely the players will agree to put a cap back in place once it's gone.

do you really think thats true? no salary cap means no salary floor. While no salary cap might help a small handful of elite players, the vast majority of players would seem to be "screwed" by the lack of a salary floor.

in the end, the point may be moot. PFT's reported that talks are picking up and subcommittee's have been formed. I think there's a very good chance the CBA will actually be extended before it expires.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

Gotcha. thanks for the explaination.



do you really think thats true? no salary cap means no salary floor. While no salary cap might help a small handful of elite players, the vast majority of players would seem to be "screwed" by the lack of a salary floor.

in the end, the point may be moot. PFT's reported that talks are picking up and subcommittee's have been formed. I think there's a very good chance the CBA will actually be extended before it expires.

Well look at baseball, do you see their players association asking for a salary cap to prevent teams like the Royals and Marlins from paying out only like 30 million in payroll expenses?

They don't do that because on the whole, the absence of a cap has driven player salaries up at a faster rate than would have otherwise been the case.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

Well look at baseball, do you see their players association asking for a salary cap to prevent teams like the Royals and Marlins from paying out only like 30 million in payroll expenses?

They don't do that because on the whole, the absence of a cap has driven player salaries up at a faster rate than would have otherwise been the case.

baseball sucks. football doesn't. apples and oranges.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

baseball sucks. football doesn't. apples and oranges.

LOL

We can definitely agree that football dominates.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

Well look at baseball, do you see their players association asking for a salary cap to prevent teams like the Royals and Marlins from paying out only like 30 million in payroll expenses?

They don't do that because on the whole, the absence of a cap has driven player salaries up at a faster rate than would have otherwise been the case.

Actually the Royals spend 70 million a year, but only 30 million on players who would otherwise be in Major League Baseball if not with the Royals.

That's like if 57% of the Redskins payroll was tied up in deadcap.

[over the mountain]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

Well look at baseball, do you see their players association asking for a salary cap to prevent teams like the Royals and Marlins from paying out only like 30 million in payroll expenses?

They don't do that because on the whole, the absence of a cap has driven player salaries up at a faster rate than would have otherwise been the case.

\
baseballs working on that. i think the league even set a cap floor to force teams like the marlins to spend more on payroll b/c the marlins owners made a profit by paying his players nothing (30 mil) while receiving (70 mil) in shared revenue.

so before the marlins ever sell a ticket or hot dog, they have already profited thanks to teams like the yankees.

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i think samuels is due for an evaluation in feb where he said he will know for sure whether he will retire or not. man, i hope he gets good news and can play.

[Redskins8588]

Originally Posted by over the mountain

\
baseballs working on that. i think the league even set a cap floor to force teams like the marlins to spend more on payroll b/c the marlins owners made a profit by paying his players nothing (30 mil) while receiving (70 mil) in shared revenue.

so before the marlins ever sell a ticket or hot dog, they have already profited thanks to teams like the yankees.

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i think samuels is due for an evaluation in feb where he said he will know for sure whether he will retire or not. man, i hope he gets good news and can play.

With the current salary cap in the NFL there too is a league min that each team must meet. I believe its something like 70% or 80% of the cap limit.

Also, as for Sauels I agree with you I hope that he can play, but as the team moves forward they need to keep in the back of their mind that Samuels isn't getting any younger...

[mlmdub130]

Originally Posted by over the mountain

\
baseballs working on that. i think the league even set a cap floor to force teams like the marlins to spend more on payroll b/c the marlins owners made a profit by paying his players nothing (30 mil) while receiving (70 mil) in shared revenue.

so before the marlins ever sell a ticket or hot dog, they have already profited thanks to teams like the yankees.

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i think samuels is due for an evaluation in feb where he said he will know for sure whether he will retire or not. man, i hope he gets good news and can play.

don't get your hopes up on him coming back