Obama Care

[Monkeydad]

State Attorney Generals in many states, including Florida and South Carolina already have lawsuits prepared as soon as it passes to challenge it since it is unconstitutional. The Government CAN NOT force people to buy a product they do not want, also there are so many special interest and pet projects for individual states in the bill that were thrown in to benefit certain states and buy their Yes votes. In addition, there are many organizations ready to join in the legal actions to overturn it. Republicans are also preparing an almost immediate bill to repeal it which may actually get the votes to pass, because some of the Yes votes are hesitant support from Congressman who are going to get barraged from their constituents for their support and will easily change their minds and support the repeal in a last-ditch effort to save their political careers.

Even if it DOES pass, there is a good chance it will be repealed either legally by the court system or a Congressional vote to reverse it. Chris Dodd and a few other Democrats who supported it and had a hand in the creation of it have announced this week they're not going to run again. The 2010 election will not go well for Democrats (GOP polling shows a tie in MA for Ted Kennedy's seat!) who supported the Healthcare bill, so even if the GOP doesn't have the votes immediately to repeal it, they definitely will after the November elections. The American people will not stand for this forcing of a bad law down our throats. Once they're being forced into something they do not want by the Government and when they realize the impact of it on their wallets, that's when they'll stand up. The wallets of the people are the one thing that pushes them into political action faster than anything else.

President Obama and the crafters of the bill did something smart politically by collecting money for 3 years and not letting the impact of the Healthcare bill start taking effect until 2013, after the next General Election, but that will also provide more than sufficient time to get the unconstitutional bill repealed as it should be.

Even if it passes, it won't survive.

[joethiesmanfan]

Originally Posted by Buster

State Attorney Generals in many states, including Florida and South Carolina already have lawsuits prepared as soon as it passes to challenge it since it is unconstitutional. The Government CAN NOT force people to buy a product they do not want, also there are so many special interest and pet projects for individual states in the bill that were thrown in to benefit certain states and buy their Yes votes. In addition, there are many organizations ready to join in the legal actions to overturn it. Republicans are also preparing an almost immediate bill to repeal it which may actually get the votes to pass, because some of the Yes votes are hesitant support from Congressman who are going to get barraged from their constituents for their support and will easily change their minds and support the repeal in a last-ditch effort to save their political careers.

Even if it DOES pass, there is a good chance it will be repealed either legally by the court system or a Congressional vote to reverse it. Chris Dodd and a few other Democrats who supported it and had a hand in the creation of it have announced this week they're not going to run again. The 2010 election will not go well for Democrats (GOP polling shows a tie in MA for Ted Kennedy's seat!) who supported the Healthcare bill, so even if the GOP doesn't have the votes immediately to repeal it, they definitely will after the November elections. The American people will not stand for this forcing of a bad law down our throats. Once they're being forced into something they do not want by the Government and when they realize the impact of it on their wallets, that's when they'll stand up. The wallets of the people are the one thing that pushes them into political action faster than anything else.

President Obama and the crafters of the bill did something smart politically by collecting money for 3 years and not letting the impact of the Healthcare bill start taking effect until 2013, after the next General Election, but that will also provide more than sufficient time to get the unconstitutional bill repealed as it should be.

Even if it passes, it won't survive.

Bush's deficit causing tax cuts passed through during secret reconciliaiton meetings. Was it unconstituional then? sorry precident has been set. Ask Mccain, he warned the Republicans back then. so don't cry now cause you set your own self up. By the way, the government forces me to pay car insurance. Is that unconstitutional?

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by joethiesmanfan

Bush's deficit causing tax cuts passed through during secret reconciliaiton meetings. Was it unconstituional then? sorry precident has been set. Ask Mccain, he warned the Republicans back then. so don't cry now cause you set your own self up. By the way, the government forces me to pay car insurance. Is that unconstitutional?

The goverment does not force you to buy car ins.

[joethiesmanfan]

Originally Posted by firstdown

The goverment does not force you to buy car ins.

Okay my fault, just the police force you to have car insurance. It's my car I don't want insurance.

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by joethiesmanfan

Okay my fault, just the police force you to have car insurance. It's my car I don't want insurance.

The police don't force you to have car ins. either. What state do you live in?

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by joethiesmanfan

Okay my fault, just the police force you to have car insurance. It's my car I don't want insurance.

Then you can't legally register the car. Most state governments mandates that if you want to register a car then you have to have insurance. You can choose not to own a car, or to not register it, in which case you do not have to buy insurance. It is a subtle distinction, but valid none the less.

[Monkeydad]

Originally Posted by joethiesmanfan

Okay my fault, just the police force you to have car insurance. It's my car I don't want insurance.

You can't compare health insurance to car insurance. Medical insurance is to protect yourself. It's a personal choice. Auto insurance is to protect the person you hit, not yourself unless you choose to pay more to cover yourself. Car insurance as a mandate makes sense to protect EVERYONE, but if you want to pay for your medical expenses out of your own pocket, that's your prerogative.

[joethiesmanfan]

Originally Posted by Buster

You can't compare health insurance to car insurance. Medical insurance is to protect yourself. It's a personal choice. Auto insurance is to protect the person you hit, not yourself unless you choose to pay more to cover yourself. Car insurance as a mandate makes sense to protect EVERYONE, but if you want to pay for your medical expenses out of your own pocket, that's your prerogative.

Not comparing health insurance to car insurance. Displaying a precedent of why mandating health insurane is constitutional. The concept of government mandating insurance on people and fining them if they don't comply, is not a foreign concept, so you can pretend it is if it makes you feel better. It is consitutional. What's unconstituinoal is DC not being a state. Ooops that would be two more democratic senators, is this a case of politics over the constitution? Also, I was giving the reasons why health insurance should be mandated.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by joethiesmanfan

Not comparing health insurance to car insurance. Displaying a precedent of why mandating health insurane is constitutional. The concept of government mandating insurance on people and fining them if they don't comply, is not a foreign concept, so you can pretend it is if it makes you feel better. It is consitutional. What's unconstituinoal is DC not being a state. Ooops that would be two more democratic senators, is this a case of politics over the constitution? Also, I was giving the reasons why health insurance should be mandated.

This is where emotions override fact. DC not being a state is unfair, silly, and undemocratic. It is not "unconstitutional"
Article 1 Section 8 of the constitution -

Section 8


The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;
...
To exercise exclusive Legislation in all Cases whatsoever, over such District (not exceeding ten Miles square) as may, by Cession of particular States, and the Acceptance of Congress, become the Seat of the Government of the United States,

This was instituted for a specific reason, so that no state or states could hold the government of the US hostage by their own militia. At this point in history maybe it makes sense to change that, but DC Statehood was specifically prohibited for several politically correct reasons back then.

besides where would a 51st star go ... geez

[joethiesmanfan]

Originally Posted by Buster

You can't compare health insurance to car insurance. Medical insurance is to protect yourself. It's a personal choice. Auto insurance is to protect the person you hit, not yourself unless you choose to pay more to cover yourself. Car insurance as a mandate makes sense to protect EVERYONE, but if you want to pay for your medical expenses out of your own pocket, that's your prerogative.

By using this reasoning, it makes more sense to mandate health insurance than car insurance. Have a wreck, no insurance, lose your car, and maybe injure your passenger or other drivers: worse case - no one can pay their doctor bills. Catch Ebola and can't pay your doctor bills worse case - you kill the whole country. More likely, the hospital cures you for free, but because you can't pay everyone else's doctor bills go sky high.

[Monkeydad]

Originally Posted by joethiesmanfan

By using this reasoning, it makes more sense to mandate health insurance than car insurance. Have a wreck, no insurance, lose your car, and maybe injure your passenger or other drivers: worse case - no one can pay their doctor bills. Catch Ebola and can't pay your doctor bills worse case - you kill the whole country. More likely, the hospital cures you for free, but because you can't pay everyone else's doctor bills go sky high.

Your brain is functioning incorrectly, you should see a doctor.

[Monkeydad]

Originally Posted by joethiesmanfan

Bush's deficit causing tax cuts passed through during secret reconciliaiton meetings. Was it unconstituional then? sorry precident has been set. Ask Mccain, he warned the Republicans back then. so don't cry now cause you set your own self up. By the way, the government forces me to pay car insurance. Is that unconstitutional?

Cutting taxes has been proven OVER AND OVER that they help the economy. The economy was booming just a couple of years after 09/11, thanks to tax cuts. They help people not only have more money in their pockets, but also allow employers to hire more people.

This is why we had 4%, almost non-existent unemployment then, and now when you factor in people who have given up looking for jobs, we have 18%.

[joethiesmanfan]

Originally Posted by Buster

Cutting taxes has been proven OVER AND OVER that they help the economy. The economy was booming just a couple of years after 09/11, thanks to tax cuts. They help people not only have more money in their pockets, but also allow employers to hire more people.

This is why we had 4%, almost non-existent unemployment then, and now when you factor in people who have given up looking for jobs, we have 18%.

BUSTER I am from South Carolina . I know for a fact tax cuts don't help the economy or create jobs. That traditional values do not improve quality of life. Legalizing guns don't get any criminals shot by civillians. South Carolina is in pitiful shape and is a conservative heaven. Run by Republicans from start to finish. From top to bottom. South Carolina is the poster child of the Democrats.

[joethiesmanfan]

Originally Posted by Buster

Cutting taxes has been proven OVER AND OVER that they help the economy. The economy was booming just a couple of years after 09/11, thanks to tax cuts. They help people not only have more money in their pockets, but also allow employers to hire more people.

This is why we had 4%, almost non-existent unemployment then, and now when you factor in people who have given up looking for jobs, we have 18%.

BUSTER!! news flash. Bush's tax cuts have not been repealed. unemployment went sky high under Bush's watch. Bush had to come on TV and beg for 700 Million dollars to save millionaires.

[Monkeydad]

Originally Posted by joethiesmanfan

BUSTER!! news flash. Bush's tax cuts have not been repealed. unemployment went sky high under Bush's watch. Bush had to come on TV and beg for 700 Million dollars to save millionaires.

The numbers spiked when the Democrats overwhelmingly took over Congress. In fact, the economy's first signs of weakness came when the balance of power shifted into the Democrat's favor. (a similar coincidence happened in the 1930s)

Tax cuts had nothing to do with the downturn, it had more to do with the housing scandals with Freddie/Fannie, also known as Barney Frank (D) /Chris Dodd (D).









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