Who Stays And Who Goes? Perceptions Changing?

I've never been a big CP fan and not only do I think we can survive without him, I think we can thrive without him. He's a me player not a team player and teams win championships. I've always thought his diva attitude with not practicing and throwing his team mates and coaches under the bus has been vastly underrated as to how detrimental it is to the team. But...that's just my opinion.

You know who also falls into this category? Laron Landry and DeAngelo Hall.

You know who also falls into this category? Laron Landry and DeAngelo Hall.

Landry and Hall aren't being divas, compared to Portis.. They both just have different ways of being "diva"; Landry celebrating every tackle, even if when the player gained big chunk of yardages.. This is becoming terribly annoying, I basically had to look away from tv whenever I see Landry making tackle.. I'm really surprised that nobody tried to get Landry to reduce it.. As for Hall; yes he did throw our front office under the bus but it is time for someone to do that.. We need some players and coaches to throw our front office under the bus, given the circumstances they forced the coaches and players to be in.. Even Haynesworth did same thing..

I don't know, fellas. I'm with Pain here. Losing to NO in a trap game is no great reason for new optimism with this staff and group of players. I give lots of credit to Zorn and especially Buges for getting these guys to play with some passion. But come on. We're not close. We're grasping at straws, IMO. Psychologically speaking, we've been so beat up this year that we're like a battered spouse saying, Yeah, he's not that bad. It's some kind of PTSD or something.

Step one: get a real GM. Then let him evaluate the roster and make decisions. No doubt some/many players will stay. But I highly doubt a good new GM is going to stick with the old regime's failed coaching staff. Why do that? As for players, let the new GM/staff have their say.

If Vinny is still in charge, what evidence do we have that things will get better? More mediocrity at best, I'm afraid.

I loved the effort and some of the play yesterday, but facts are facts. We are not close.

Who goes for me by trade, retire, or release. No personal feelings just business:
Todd Collins
Phillip Daniels
Malcolm Kelly
Marcus Mason
Anthony Montgomery
Fred Smoot
Antwaan Randle El
Carlos Rogers
Renaldo Wynn
Ladell Betts
Chris Samuels
Randy Thomas
Jim Zorn

Notable not on list:
Laron Landry- He is a great player out of position. We need a free safety to give us the opportunity to move him to his natural position.
Clinton Portis- I really would like to see how he would be in a real rotation and behind a decent oline, I'm not ready to give up on him yet. His "me-first" attitude and unwillingness to practice I am also willing to let him go though.
Santanna Moss- Has heart and could be a monster if he is shifted around the formations to create mismatches as well as the slot.

I would put Moss on the trade list and keep Kelly instead. I'd also keep Betts.

We need to shop away CP, Landry, and Rogers.
Between the three of them, I think they are the biggest distractions to the team- I want to add Hall to the list but we can't get rid of our entire secondary. Portis's attitude, Landry's showboat attitude, and unfortunately Roger's standoff with the organization and coaches.

To note though, the great and late Sean Taylor's first two seasons were spotted with blown assignments, unsportsmanlike conduct penalties- you name it. It wasn't until seasons 3 and 4 that he became the player we hoped we'd get out of him.

Otherwise, between the three of them we can probably get a few quality mid-round picks. Maybe a 2 and 3?

I don't know, fellas. I'm with Pain here. Losing to NO in a trap game is no great reason for new optimism with this staff and group of players. I give lots of credit to Zorn and especially Buges for getting these guys to play with some passion. But come on. We're not close. We're grasping at straws, IMO. Psychologically speaking, we've been so beat up this year that we're like a battered spouse saying, Yeah, he's not that bad. It's some kind of PTSD or something.

Step one: get a real GM. Then let him evaluate the roster and make decisions. No doubt some/many players will stay. But I highly doubt a good new GM is going to stick with the old regime's failed coaching staff. Why do that? As for players, let the new GM/staff have their say.

If Vinny is still in charge, what evidence do we have that things will get better? More mediocrity at best, I'm afraid.

I loved the effort and some of the play yesterday, but facts are facts. We are not close.

Have you watched the games since the 2nd half of the Atlanta game? They should have beaten the Cowboys (Suisham missed 2 FG) should have beaten Philly in Philly and yesterday's game because of Suisham again. Remember this team is playing without:

Samuels
Thomas
Portis
Cooley
Rinehart
Betts
Jarmon
Horton

Haynesworth was also out of the Eagles and Cowboys game and could have been a difference maker.

And has still enough talent

It is clear some of the young players are finally starting to produce, the three high draft picks from last year most notably.
There are some players that when healthy are great, but they can not stay healthy. This is a problem. We should not continue to roll the dice and pray they can stay healthy when it is clear they can not. Best example of this is Randy Thomas, they guy is a great player when healthy, but he can not stay healthy for an entire season. It is time to cut our losses.
We need to get younger especially on the O and D lines.

Damn, this is so difficult to figure out, much like this whole season. I read all these ideas about what to do and what not to do, and I can find reasons to agree and disagree with all of them! But I think ultamitley I dont want a complete overhaul this offseason. I feel like their are legit reasons to keep this thing going with some obvious tweeks and let it run one more season. This is not the same team that played the first half of the season which had zero signs of potential and rarely resembled a pro football team. This second half of the season hasnt resulted into wins, but their is some serious signs of life and positive momentum going down the stretch and I truly believe the right offseason additions could get this team where it needs to be. But then again, who the hell knows! :confused-

I think the two major off-season changes that could have the most impact, with the littlest disruption: 1) fire VC. I think he has done better than most give him credit, but he has ignored the OL and is basically a divisive character, not a unifying one. 2) bring in an OC who calls his full plays. Preferably not a completely new system. And Zorn stays due to his presence this year. I think we could have seen this whole team simply go up in smoke, with the injuries and early losses, but Zorn has kept them together. I don't really think he will make it as a HC, but I think what he has done is worth one more year to build on. Just get a unified playcalling structure, (not Sherm Lewis, who I am very happy with, but is a stop gap solution, not the next great thing)

Somebody called in NFL radio a few minutes ago and asked Marty what he thought, and he said doesn't think we should blow things up. He basically said keep what works and keep building. He thinks Zorn should stay.