Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate

Just a side note, it's almost uncanny how aligned you and I are on the issues. I'm very to the right on foreign policy and the economy, and quite left on most social issues, with the exception of abortion. Didn't think I'd find too many people that line up so crooked like I do.

I'm a card carrying member of that group.

Okay, I can dig that. But that definition is a little too abstract for me. What about those who don't or can't serve in the military. How are they to prove their love or defend our country? Surely that would leave out hundreds of millions of Americans, wouldn't it? Another thing, since you cite the Declaration of Independence, The Constitution, The Bill of Rights, how does the institution of slavery factor into this and more recently, the Jim Crow era, as it relates to our founding fathers and their ideals of sacracfice and service?

I'm not trying to stir the pot, just trying to see exactly when did America start loving and defending other Americans - all Americans.

I believe that patriotism is a feeling that should be conveyed in words, or, at the very least, is not a feeling we should try to hide. I think people should recognize the great many things this country has to offer and be proud of them. Unfortunately, I agree with some of the sentiments expressed earlier in this thread regarding the left. Many on the left will snicker, jeer and sneer at open expressions of love for one's country. In many circles it is definitely lame to fly a flag outside your home. To me, that is constitutes sheer "brattiness" and a failure to appreciate just how good we Americans have things.

However, I also believe patriotism is expressed through action. Failing to recognize flaws, or recognizing and ignoring them, is unpatriotic. Sacrificing liberty for safety is both selfish and unpatriotic. And, oftentimes, those on the right fail to recognize and correct the flaws in our past and present and tend to sacrifice liberty for safety.

I believe that patriotism is a feeling that should be conveyed in words, or, at the very least, is not a feeling we should try to hide. I think people should recognize the great many things this country has to offer and be proud of them. Unfortunately, I agree with some of the sentiments expressed earlier in this thread regarding the left. Many on the left will snicker, jeer and sneer at open expressions of love for one's country. In many circles it is definitely lame to fly a flag outside your home. To me, that is sad and sheer "brattiness" and a failure to appreciate just how good we Americans have things.

However, I also believe patriotism is expressed through action. Failing to recognize flaws, or recognizing and ignoring them, is unpatriotic. Sacrificing liberty for safety is both selfish and unpatriotic. And, oftentimes, those on the right fail to recognize the flaws in our past and present and tend to sacrifice liberty for safety.


Hmmm....so you believe patriotism is both a feeling and action. I like this.

I gotta say one more thing, while it's on my mind. Just because it's on my mind.

I certainly respect every opinion here on the board, but boy did it bug the hell out of me that at the GOP convention tonight, their theme is "Country First." The sub-text being, if you're not with us, you're not putting country first. Or this is the party that has a corner on patriotism. In 2008 because I'm pro-choice, you're telling me I don't want country first? Or because we differ on taxes and government, I'm putting country first?

I gotta say one more thing, while it's on my mind. Just because it's on my mind.

I certainly respect every opinion here on the board, but boy did it bug the hell out of me that at the GOP convention tonight, their theme is "Country First." The sub-text being, if you're not with us, you're not putting country first. Or this is the party that has a corner on patriotism. In 2008 because I'm pro-choice, you're telling me I don't want country first? Or because we differ on taxes and government, I'm putting country first?

Obviously it's political rhetoric and I think you are looking to deep in it. They just want a catch phrase like the Dems and "Change". Either side, it's bullshit really.

I gotta say one more thing, while it's on my mind. Just because it's on my mind.

I certainly respect every opinion here on the board, but boy did it bug the hell out of me that at the GOP convention tonight, their theme is "Country First." The sub-text being, if you're not with us, you're not putting country first. Or this is the party that has a corner on patriotism. In 2008 because I'm pro-choice, you're telling me I don't want country first? Or because we differ on taxes and government, I'm putting country first?

I personally think you're reading too much into that.

Obviously it's political rhetoric and I think you are looking to deep in it. They just want a catch phrase like the Dems and "Change". Either side, it's bullshit really.


Wait a minute, you're telling me it's just a slogan and they don't mean that? Because John McCain has certainly echoed those sentiments in a few speeches on the stump this year.

I was shocked, and quite frankly offended, to see it plastered all over the auditorium.

I personally think you're reading too much into that.

Okay, someone please explain it to me. Because I've honestly tried to not read too much into it.

Okay, someone please explain it to me. Because I've honestly tried to not read too much into it.

I think you should probably explain why you took it to mean all the things you thought.

Wait a minute, you're telling me it's just a slogan and they don't mean that? Because John McCain has certainly echoed those sentiments in a few speeches on the stump this year.

I was shocked, and quite frankly offended, to see it plastered all over the auditorium.

Well I guess what I am trying to say is politicians say all sorts of bull and do another thing. You are right it is a bit offensive, but tonight what you saw at the RNC is something is pretty prevalent in politics.

I am sure some of his supporters believe that, but McCain knows its just a phrase to get support.